I don't remember we had such a thread at D&D but, at these times of oppression, I thought that maybe it was important, that a group that puts friendship above our mutual differences, to be able to discuss the ultimate questions.
There is no absolute freedom, I know that, all of you know that, but one thing is certain, there is a basic need for freedom for every man, so important as breathing or eating, no matter our nationality, religion, social level or race.
Do you fell happy with the amount of freedom you have?
Simple as that... :)
No, I don't feel that I'm enough free, but I'm working on that. :)
Always have my entire life.
I know I'm somewhat more free than many people on this planet, but no, I don't think I'm sufficiently free. :)
It would be awfully nice to be free from economical pressure.
Amen.
It would be awfully nice to be free from economical pressure.
To many people it would be buying a house that turns them economical dependent for the entire life. I see young people committing that error over and over again.
Twenty, thirty years with an huge financial effort constantly and, even more worst, tied to a particular place, limited to accept job offers at that area, the same neighborhood, seeing the same people everyday, no possibility to change their lives easily.
An asphyxiating lack of perspectives and options.
Mobility it's fundamental as an expression of freedom. Don't buy, rent it.
There is no absolute freedom, I know that, all of you know that, but one thing is certain, there is a basic need for freedom for every man, so important as breathing or eating, no matter our nationality, religion, social level or race.
You seem to be sort of Belfragercentric at this one
;)The first (upper) question "is freedom something that is unavoidably needed?", or, more subject-oriented, "do you feel like you need freedom above most?". (And in any case we need to define
freedom first(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Ffiles.myopera.com%2FJoshL%2FSml%2Fnono.gif&hash=e1db3819ab63ee31c3635aa25deee230" rel="cached" data-hash="e1db3819ab63ee31c3635aa25deee230" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://files.myopera.com/JoshL/Sml/nono.gif))
I'm a full-time mother amongst other things. Do I feel I could be freer? Sure. I'm grateful for the freedom I do have because many don't have as much as me.
Freedom is a vague concept unless tied to something specific. Everybody is constrained in many ways.
Freedom from economic concerns. Donald Trump is, but he isn't free of the nagging possibility that he might be targeted by some nimrod who wants him dead just because he's Donald Trump. I, on the other hand, am free from that likelihood. Nobody's targeting Jim Brotherton...well, maybe rjhowie, but that's it.
(And in any case we need to define freedom first)
Freedom is a vague concept unless tied to something specific. Everybody is constrained in many ways.
The condition of being free of restraints. Seems to me a definition good enough. If restrained to be tied to something specific, it's not freedom, just choice. If, besides that, just a certain number of options are given to you to chose from, then it's not even choice.
I'm a full-time mother amongst other things. Do I feel I could be freer? Sure.
Motherhood characterizes in the first place by the abnegation of putting other life first than ours. It's one of the few things that are above freedom and, in this sense, should be always considered sacred.
Economics it's certainly at the front line of what people considers to be a limitation to their freedom, but who putted economics there? Who gave economics such a power?
We did, despite being told the entire life that money would not bring us happiness...
I live in "The Land of the Free"-- or so they tell us anyway. I have a "job" that by its very nature attracts free spirit types, but at the same time burdens you with worries you wouldn't have in some other line of work.
I could be "free-er" than I am now, I suppose-- but the funny thing is, some of the things we think make us free actually make us worse off instead of better.
The condition of being free of restraints. Seems to me a definition good enough.
Well, I'm restrained by gravitation!
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Ffiles.myopera.com%2FJoshL%2Fsml0%2Flol.gif&hash=5658d6826764d1940175c65c6fc2a07d" rel="cached" data-hash="5658d6826764d1940175c65c6fc2a07d" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://files.myopera.com/JoshL/sml0/lol.gif)
I live in "The Land of the Free"-- or so they tell us anyway. I have a "job" that by its very nature attracts free spirit types, but at the same time burdens you with worries you wouldn't have in some other line of work.
I could be "free-er" than I am now, I suppose-- but the funny thing is, some of the things we think make us free actually make us worse off instead of better.
Freedom is not synonymous of absence of worrying, very much the contrary.
That's the beginning of the problem, a so complex world that will bring so much worries to those that pretends to maintain their freedom that people prefers to abdicate from it.
Slavery where slaves desires to keep being slaves, the perfect dead end, the perfect no way out...
Freedom is not synonymous of absence of worrying, very much the contrary.
The notion of freedom has too many footnotes, so claims of freedom need an infinite number of qualifications.
:-\
My wife is not free.
She is very expensive.
The notion of freedom has too many footnotes, so claims of freedom need an infinite number of qualifications.
No, just one, your feeling.
If you want to go further and analyze why you feel free then you need just three conditions, awareness, non compulsivity and moral.
The condition of being free of restraints. Seems to me a definition good enough. If restrained to be tied to something specific, it's not freedom, just choice. If, besides that, just a certain number of options are given to you to chose from, then it's not even choice.
If that's what freedom is then nobody's free in any significant way. I'm free to comb what's left of my hair, but in so many much more significant ways, I'm not.
f that's what freedom is then nobody's free in any significant way. I'm free to comb what's left of my hair, but in so many much more significant ways, I'm not.
Well, I'm waiting that then you say a better definition of freedom.
The one I got was clearly a dictionary type of definition. Man is a "social animal", it means, per itself, that we prefer to trade some freedom for other things. Security for example. Or social ties.
But, if so, how do we know that we've traded already too much? :)
That's the problem.
Well, I'm waiting that then you say a better definition of freedom.
The one I got was clearly a dictionary type of definition. Man is a "social animal", it means, per itself, that we prefer to trade some freedom for other things. Security for example. Or social ties.
Freedom from something, freedom to do something. Both can be illusions. In some cases I think I'm free from, say, an al Qaeda bombing. Grand Rapids is not a likely target, but who knows?
I think I'm free to walk into the kitchen to prepare dinner. I've done it hundreds of times, but the next time I might not be able to do it.
However unlikely those two cases might be, they are possibilities. There is a point at which the world that I imagine to be secure will come to a screeching halt. :'(
There is a point at which the world that I imagine to be secure will come to a screeching halt. :'(
You've introduced a perspective that I didn't thought about, "freedom from".
To me, freedom is always "freedom to do".
Maybe there's a time for both freedoms during a man's life.
I know too many people that, at their age, they deserve to be "free from" many things and they aren't.
It seems that either at "freedom from" or "freedom to do" we are too short of what's desirable for a man.
I think you are going to need a larger can.
Once you get onto the subject of "freedom from" you open up a can of worms that "freedom to do" knows little of. Some freedoms we took for granted here turn out to be illusions, too-- freedom from unwarranted search and seizure being right up there if reports are any indication. Freedom from fear-- uh, remember that freedom from unwarranted search? The reason for all that warrantless wiretapping is fear of terrorism--so I reckon we can rule that out for awhile. Freedom from want? Not so you'd notice, and in case it does escape your attention just ask RJH-- I'm sure he'll be happy to tell you all about how the free-est country on earth can't feed its own people.
Freedom to do is, by comparison, relatively simple. If I want to build a bookshelf, I can do this. I just need decent plans, a couple of tools and some supplies and I can build a bookshelf. I have as much freedom to build this as my finances will allow. I can call a friend any time I want, I have freedom to do this. I can make bacon and eggs until the very sight of it turns your stomach-- I have as much freedom to do this as a body can stand.
So-- Freedom from may be more crucial, and much harder to come by, than freedom to do. Even in so-called free nations, it turns out that certain key freedoms simply don't exist-- or if they do, they have to be bought at such a dear price that I doubt "free" is the word I'd want to apply to it.
The freeest people in the world are the dead — they are free from life with its burdens...
:rip:
Once you get onto the subject of "freedom from" you open up a can of worms that "freedom to do" knows little of.
Certainly.
I suppose Jimbro introduced the "freedom from" concept just in order to avoid the problem of not enough "freedom to do" question.
Freedom from, although eventually correct, it's something that's better expressed as being
protected from or being
safe from (at least at the mental frame set of my language).
It has not too much to do with Freedom.
It would be awfully nice to be free from economical pressure.
We live in a society filled with dreams and aspirations of wealth, a society that likes to believe that money will bring with it happiness and success. The will to succeed is overpowering for some, and the pressure can be all-consuming. Mental pressure can take many forms; stress can enter our lives at any time, regardless of timing or situation. The following men were all successful businessmen who committed suicide. The millions in their bank accounts did nothing to ease their suffering…
http://www.businesspundit.com/10-millionaire-businessmen-who-committed-suicide/ (http://www.businesspundit.com/10-millionaire-businessmen-who-committed-suicide/)
I'm far from being wealthy, but financially secure enough to have no immediate worries. I'm certainly not looking for a tall building.
Why does everyone identifies freedom (or lack of it) with financial/economic status?
Keep on doing that will make you money slaves the rest of your lives.
I had money, I lost all the money, I had money again, I lost all the money again... and so on and so on...
I got tired of being a money slave, there's much better things on life to be lived than money. Freedom and passion (maybe antagonistic things, eh? :) ) are surely more important than money.
I got tired of being a money slave, there's much better things on life to be lived than money. Freedom and passion (maybe antagonistic things, eh? ) are surely more important than money.
Generally speaking, I agree, but there are things that require money...raising children, having enough to buy food and keep a roof over one's head.
I got tired of being a money slave, there's much better things on life to be lived than money. Freedom and passion (maybe antagonistic things, eh? ) are surely more important than money.
Generally speaking, I agree, but there are things that require money...raising children, having enough to buy food and keep a roof over one's head.
Actually, none of these requires any money. Children need clothes, food, education, and a home, and parents need the capacity to provide those things. Money is just a detour to get what we
really need.
Actually, none of these requires any money. Children need clothes, food, education, and a home, and parents need the capacity to provide those things. Money is just a detour to get what we really need.
Please explain that. Where do you buy things without money? Some sort of barter system?
Actually, none of these requires any money. Children need clothes, food, education, and a home, and parents need the capacity to provide those things. Money is just a detour to get what we really need.
Please explain that. Where do you buy things without money? Some sort of barter system?
Incidentally, I grew up in a farm, almost all my uncles are construction workers and I myself have a university degree and teacher qualification. So, if the world functioned normally, the children could have all those things provided by the immediate circle of their own family. Alas, the world is insane and we all have to be busy earning money to buy necessary things and services, even though we actually have the skills to do it all by ourselves.
We are not free to do what we want and have the skills for. We are forced to do what brings in money. Stupid system.
The freedom to work, earn, create, act upon your inner entrepreneurship, & gather what you need using your own skills, or use the freedom to pay others to do it for you.
Then again, rather than straining your mind & body, why not let the government do it all for you for free, freeing up more free time for
you to enjoy freely at someone else's expense. (https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/hitqt9.gif)
Now that's freedom, courtesy of BHO, & his democRAT Party --
Originally contrived by the socialists of the EU. Monkey see, monkey do. (https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/notme.gif)
We are not free to do what we want and have the skills for. We are forced to do what brings in money. Stupid system.
Yes and it goes further than that. It
models people's lives and expectations in a way that's not too much different from mind control. Mind control from birth until death.
Few people can get rid of this. This is probably the most important thing in life, the right to have our own lives.
Governments are today part of the problem not of the solution.
Incidentally, I grew up in a farm, almost all my uncles are construction workers and I myself have a university degree and teacher qualification. So, if the world functioned normally, the children could have all those things provided by the immediate circle of their own family. Alas, the world is insane and we all have to be busy earning money to buy necessary things and services, even though we actually have the skills to do it all by ourselves. We are not free to do what we want and have the skills for. We are forced to do what brings in money. Stupid system.
It's still not clear what you mean (see the words in italics). You want to buy things without money, or earning it? Or do you want to barter, or do you want to make everything by yourself, - what sort of society do you envisage that would empower you to have that possibility?
If you envisage the so-called "simple life" where you live on a farm, grow or rear your own food and rely on no-one for anything else, you are surely thinking of a middle-age society or maybe even before that.
We are not free to do what we want and have the skills for. We are forced to do what brings in money. Stupid system.
You can't even farm without money, and you aren't forced to do what earns money.
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.fartlab.com%2Fimage%2F5106dae400a8b%2Ffull.jpg&hash=6cb5f8fc30448a437f66c919ebd4a4a5" rel="cached" data-hash="6cb5f8fc30448a437f66c919ebd4a4a5" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://www.fartlab.com/image/5106dae400a8b/full.jpg)
If you envisage the so-called "simple life" where you live on a farm, grow or rear your own food and rely on no-one for anything else, you are surely thinking of a middle-age society or maybe even before that.
I have lived in anarchy - namely, the regime change era when Soviet Union fell apart from about 1989 to 1995. Money was worth nothing (hyperinflation); shops were empty; jobs were sometimes useful, but for other reasons than money; government administration didn't work in any manner (most of the time we didn't know who was in charge). What kept us alive was producing milk, fruit, and vegetables for ourselves by ourselves. Relatives in the city came to the farm to help often. They wanted their share too, because it's self-evident that food keeps you alive. Worked just fine, no money needed. Is there something unclear in this? Something dubious? Something outlandish? Weird Western people, what planet are you living on?
We are not free to do what we want and have the skills for. We are forced to do what brings in money. Stupid system.
You can't even farm without money, and you aren't forced to do what earns money.
During the era I described above, there were effectively no taxes, for two reasons: 1. Hyperinflation (which ended in monetary reform) 2. Weak government, lack of enforcement. Mafia was the government, but mafia didn't extend to the countryside.
Under the current order, you have to pay taxes - in money only. And the money system has been stretched everywhere without any apparent reason. I don't know in your country, but here you have to pay taxes, if you do/own anything that resembles a business, and when you work under a business - which of course covers pretty much everyone. For example my family farm was not a registered business, we thought we were just having our own life, but it sufficiently resembled a business so that when some government finally emerged, we were asked to pay taxes recursively based on estimates out of thin air, because there had been no real currency and no value for money for about half a decade - and there had been no business, just government regulation made up and enforced at some point what is considered a business. To pay taxes you have to have a job and earn money. To have a job you are forced to have a bank account, which is basically another layer of taxes on top of the government taxes. All regularly recurring fees and usury I consider taxes. Government, banks, and mafia work this way.
I have lived in anarchy - namely, the regime change era when Soviet Union fell apart from about 1989 to 1995. Money was worth nothing (hyperinflation); shops were empty; jobs were sometimes useful, but for other reasons than money; government administration didn't work in any manner (most of the time we didn't know who was in charge). What kept us alive was producing milk, fruit, and vegetables for ourselves by ourselves. Relatives in the city came to the farm to help often. They wanted their share too, because it's self-evident that food keeps you alive. Worked just fine, no money needed. Is there something unclear in this? Something dubious? Something outlandish? Weird Western people, what planet are you living on?
???? Are you seriously promoting that as a way to live !!!!
PS - as an aside --- when I typed the above I typed "?" four times. The icon appeared all by itself and three "?" went. A new quirk!
I have lived in anarchy - namely, the regime change era when Soviet Union fell apart from about 1989 to 1995. Money was worth nothing (hyperinflation); shops were empty; jobs were sometimes useful, but for other reasons than money; government administration didn't work in any manner (most of the time we didn't know who was in charge). What kept us alive was producing milk, fruit, and vegetables for ourselves by ourselves. Relatives in the city came to the farm to help often. They wanted their share too, because it's self-evident that food keeps you alive. Worked just fine, no money needed. Is there something unclear in this? Something dubious? Something outlandish? Weird Western people, what planet are you living on?
???? Are you seriously promoting that as a way to live !!!!
You can promote whatever you want, but I prefer decent subsistence under whatever circumstances. The circumstances are not up to me. Nor up to you.
We did well. We didn't become a band of robbers even though this was the most profitable way to live at the time. It was not a short time. Nothing indicated how long it would last, if it's permanent or temporary. Given this experience, to me any order as well as disorder is temporary.
Weird Western people, what planet are you living on?
The planet of easiness, emptiness and consumerism that leads to serfdom.
Amen.
Income Inequality will, & should always, exist........
Yes, inspire others to excel, but taking earned income from those that strive to earn it, & giving it to the those with less......who didn't earn it, just because they have less, creates a permanent underclass with no incentive to achieve higher standards for themselves, or anything better for their families on their own.
"Underclass"/shmunderclass -- it doesn't matter.
Contest has since the beginning of Time been the corner stone to the survival of any thinkable species. Including such a pest like hoomun.
Communism=Death.
Communism=Death
Socialism=An obtuser form of Death, but Death nevertheless.
“The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.” ― Margaret Thatcher
In this country (US), I feel extremely free, financially-speaking.
On the social aspect of things, I do not fee quite as free.
In fact, (and @String will get a kick out of this), I felt more free (again, socially-speaking) in the UK than I did in this country.
Some will find that answer confusing. To sum it up, in the region I live, speaking your mind on religious aspects is looked down on. I have been speaking my mind on that matter for years. I've lost "friends" over it, but have kept on trucking. Also, once again in this region, if you are not in lock-step with the current fashionable "Conservative", you are thought strange. "Conservative" in this region of the country means, "I am for limited gov't, except when my party is in control; then, I will use gov't for big gov't legislation, like prohibiting things I do not like".
Makes me shake my head every time I think about it, but such is life.
I consider myself reasonably free as I don't live in the ex-colonies across the pond!
I know what you mean...it isn't easy. This is a pic of me some years ago. That said, freedom isn't everything.
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fpakistancriminalrecords.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2012%2F08%2FMan-recovered-in-chains-from-factory.jpg&hash=b7b233b3ee02da1227218bd966b5355c" rel="cached" data-hash="b7b233b3ee02da1227218bd966b5355c" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://pakistancriminalrecords.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/Man-recovered-in-chains-from-factory.jpg)
I know what you mean...it isn't easy. This is a pic of me some years decades ago. That said, freedom isn't everything.
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fpakistancriminalrecords.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2012%2F08%2FMan-recovered-in-chains-from-factory.jpg&hash=b7b233b3ee02da1227218bd966b5355c" rel="cached" data-hash="b7b233b3ee02da1227218bd966b5355c" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://pakistancriminalrecords.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/Man-recovered-in-chains-from-factory.jpg)
Fixed that for you. :)
I consider myself reasonably free as I don't live in the ex-colonies across the pond!
Yes, Americans seems to be much less free than Europeans despite their fossil constitution about freedom, tyrannical governments and getting guns.
But how ironical to listen it from an occupied wanna be independent place. :)
I cannot but agree 100% with you there Belfrager because that is fundamentally right. Odd it has been so overlooked?
Bel, I think Mr, Howie has missed your point.
Bel, I think Mr, Howie has missed your point.
In this case Mr. Howie simply overlooked the last part of Bel's post. Our highly respected Scot is adamantly opposed to independence.
Bel, I think Mr, Howie has missed your point.
Mr Howie misses a lot of my points. Normal, he's a protestant.
But I think that you, tt92, you have the conditions to be one of the most free person here.
I hope you are :)
Our highly respected Scot is adamantly opposed to independence.
Absolutely, he searches dependence. Poor Scotland, it used to be free centuries ago...
Bel, I think Mr, Howie has missed your point.
In this case Mr. Howie simply overlooked the last part of Bel's post.
Which I believed to be its point.
Which I believed to be its point.
This has become too complicated for me.
(https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/banana-monkey-34.gif)
No one says "Yes, I'm a proud free man."
That was my point.
I need to look somewhere else.
People have to start joining, if not by physical proximity, than by communication for the creation of a network.
Brothers in arms.
.......Brothers in arms
[glow=black,2,300]Now Yer Talkin'![/glow]
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FIfKaPrr.jpg&hash=062354cb5b8503bc62d3c8d7b4ec5211" rel="cached" data-hash="062354cb5b8503bc62d3c8d7b4ec5211" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://i.imgur.com/IfKaPrr.jpg)
[glow=black,2,300]Because Freedom doesn't come Free![/glow]
I could do with a little more freedom. I work in an industry that has always been highly regulated, and as each day passes it seem that more regulations-- written by bureaucrats who have never driven a truck and have no idea what it's all about-- get passed down to us. I have a friend in the business who has just sold his truck because the cost of regulation made it not profitable to stay in the business. So-- I could do with a bit more freedom.
At that, I'm on the free-est end of the business. Cargo vans aren't regulated to the extent that the big trucks are, so I do have a measure of freedom that the friend I mentioned never did have.
I am free to do anything I want to do.
The situation is simplified by the fact that I don't realistically want to do things that would be forbidden me.
One day, as I grow feeble and incapable, my driver's licence will be taken from me.
I hope I will then have the wit to see that I shouldn't drive and not regret it too much.
On this occasion I fully agree with Smileyfaze terror supporter. Freedom doesn't come free. It was the money lot that started the Revolution and have run the place ever since and look at the stae it is in for the majority.
Yes, Freedom doesn't come free.
I am free to do anything I want to do.
The situation is simplified by the fact that I don't realistically want to do things that would be forbidden me.
One day, as I grow feeble and incapable, my driver's licence will be taken from me.
I hope I will then have the wit to see that I shouldn't drive and not regret it too much.
Just like Superman!
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.bedetheque.com%2Fcache%2Fthb_couv%2FCouv_139928.jpg&hash=17155d7e70582883e4bc0724de05147b" rel="cached" data-hash="17155d7e70582883e4bc0724de05147b" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://www.bedetheque.com/cache/thb_couv/Couv_139928.jpg)
One day, as I grow feeble and incapable, my driver's licence will be taken from me.
I hope I will then have the wit to see that I shouldn't drive and not regret it too much.
So [glow=green,2,300]
they[/glow] will decide when you must stop driving.
What if you disagree, feel great, see great, have excellent reflexes & hand eye coordination, & haven't has any problems driving.........but[glow=green,2,300]
they[/glow] take your license away anyway because at your age you should be feeble & incapable of driving.
How free are you to aggressively pursue the government (at their expense, not yours) to overturn[glow=green,2,300]
their[/glow] decision, & return your license, which you contend was wrongfully taken away.........or do you just rollover, submit quietly to the government like a good ole boy, take it in the waazoo, & prepare for death?
Of course not. How could you suggest such a thing.
I'd put on my tricorn hat and a stern expression, load up my trusty flintlock, and shoot anyone who came within fifty feet.
Of course not. How could you suggest such a thing.
I'd put on my tricorn hat and a stern expression, load up my trusty flintlock, and shoot anyone who came within fifty feet.
Ok, so in short, like an obedient
boy sheep bird, (https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/secretrc9.gif) you'd sob & take it in the tail.
I don't care if people thinks that SmileyFaze is wrong or not.
Things are much worst than people thinks and only radical positions will grant freedom. This is not a moment for sissies but a moment for real men.
We'll see who is at each side of the barricade. Because the moment of barricades is coming soon.
Open your eyes.
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FhuWSrhp.png&hash=c4ecf66400a71dd71883016307af2d88" rel="cached" data-hash="c4ecf66400a71dd71883016307af2d88" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://i.imgur.com/huWSrhp.png)
I don't care if people thinks that SmileyFaze is wrong or not.
Things are much worst than people thinks and only radical positions will grant freedom.
Well, I suggest they ask the European Jews of 1939-1944 how they felt they were treated.
Did they stand up against oppression, or lay prostrate to it?
Did they believe in their eventual fate?
History will repeat for those that learn nothing from it.
Denial is a dirty word.
The only maxim of a free government ought to be to trust no man living with power to endanger the public liberty.........JQA
Actively restrict government at every opportunity & turn. To ignore this obligation will hasten your entry into bondage........SF
Well many Jews did die unfortunately but they are not the only ones who suffered. A 7 figure number died in Cambodia in the Red times. There were drive massacres in the old Turkish Ottoman Empire.In the USSR far more people died including on racial grounds than Jews in the late 1930 and 40 period. In fact the deliberate pogroms by Stalin in one State seen more dying than in the 'Holocaust.'Just under a million German soldiers die in US captivity post WW2. Need we go on? There were others in history but the difference is that with so many Jews involved in places of power including the media and economics they can highlight their corner
Mass deaths for whatever reason are never justifiable and on historical matters the Jewish race has used it's influence to somehow create the mythology that they are top of the list. So when it comes to history Smileyfaze there is always a wider picture than that propagated to us. You are right on that statement.........
Mass deaths for whatever reason are never justifiable and on historical matters the Jewish race has used it's influence to somehow create the mythology that they are top of the list
I imagine that Simon Wiesenthal, the nazi "hunter", most be already hunting you...
Don't worry, you can always ask for my help. :)
I'm a very expensive help, by the way, but effective...
What he would charge you for rj, I'd be thrilled to do for free .... Except for a blowjob, for that you'll have to deal with expensively (https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/blowjob002.gif) effective Bel. (https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/chuckle002.gif)
I'm a very expensive help, by the way, but effective...
Exceedingly generous of you there Belfrager. But (cough, cough) the hunter is as they would say here, "deid." Anyway he was not all he was cracked up to be as my brother traced info about him that showed his own history was not all completely accurate. What I do get tired of is the constant stuff we get about the holocaust as if it was the only one that ever happened. As I said more got snuffed out in the old USSR and there were other historical examples. Trouble is that with many Jewish people in positions of power and the media they get the high ground given to them. They also use WW2 as some sort of modern excuse in the ME to do what they like. Anyway I am not feart of Zionists any more than I am of ex-colonists. Paying excessive fees I would have no probs with as I appreciate that Lisbon still has my great interest - trams.
Except for a blowjob, for that you'll have to deal with expensively (https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/blowjob002.gif) effective Bel. (https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/chuckle002.gif)
Is it? is seems that you are an expert about blowjobs... probably a family specialization on such area of services.
:yes:
Looked back at that picture earlier from Smileyfaze of his revolutionary lot. The freedom thing is a load of baloney as from the start it was corporate led and still is. Americans only think they are free. The corporates noty only control the government but the press and television, etc. The big tv networks have seen a number of journalists leaving because reports or investigations they looked into were cut so as not to offend the corporates who fund the systems. Freedom is an oft used word but it has no comparison with what is enshrined in the constitution. Today the government ignores the law when it suits and uses security and other garbage to infringe people continually.
Americans only think they are free. The corporates noty only control the government but the press and television, etc.
Free from what?
Is rjhowie free, or is he held captive by his anti-US mania?
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youlol.net%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2011%2F02%2Fblah-blah-blah-185x185.jpg&hash=7974e746073d3fde1233d3a844aff89f" rel="cached" data-hash="7974e746073d3fde1233d3a844aff89f" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://www.youlol.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/blah-blah-blah-185x185.jpg)
noty
You know exactly what he meant Josh so no need to be so pedantic.
Rest of your post removed.
Well jimbro we have an equality what with your anti-Russian/Putin mania. Just because you are comfortable off proves nothing against what I declare. You cannot even find a worthwhile party to vote for. As long as your nation continues to try and rule the world, contradict it's own constitution when the government feels like it, continue to create wars and be the greatest hypocrisy nation on Earth there is plenty to see to! Pedantic suits the man from Michigan as saves doing any exercise except in a chair and computer. If you could have atheist monks he would get in with no problem! ::)
If you could have atheist monks he would get in with no problem!
I'd love to be free of religious notions. This was a silly thing to say unless you completely misunderstand atheism.
It's not really a belief there is no god(s). It's more a lack of belief in god(s). That the religious don't or won't understand the difference is a bit droll. Atheism isn't a religion or belief system. There's no limit to what not believing in deities can mean. The term really means nothing overly useful unless you're religious.
If you could have atheist monks he would get in with no problem!
I'd love to be free of religious notions. This was a silly thing to say unless you completely misunderstand atheism.
It's not really a belief there is no god(s). It's more a lack of belief in god(s). That the religious don't or won't understand the difference is a bit droll. Atheism isn't a religion or belief system. There's no limit to what not believing in deities can mean. The term really means nothing overly useful unless you're religious.
Absolutely! I believe in the Easter Bunny and Santa Claus but not in the parting the Red Sea and the loaves and fishes business.
There is no absolute freedom, I know that, all of you know that, but one thing is certain, there is a basic need for freedom for every man, so important as breathing or eating, no matter our nationality, religion, social level or race.
Eating and breathing aren't freedoms, and they aren't limited to men. They're necessities for all critters large and small with the exception of anaerobic bacteria.
...breathing ...with the exception of anaerobic bacteria.
Not exactly.
Anaerobics breathe as well[abbr=› not needing ... oxygen:]*[/abbr].
Now I see the word's morphology is confusing - "without air", while the meaning is only "without oxygen". They have their own "air" to breathe on...:)
Maybe more politicians without air would be something?
They have their own "air" to breathe on....
...by splitting H²O to get O².
The Russian is right again.
First, they are lower indexes - in chemistry to count atoms (ions) in a molecule. The upper right one is used for the ionisation parameter and usually has either a plus or minus in front of it.
The lower left is to count protons in the nucleus, the upper left - the atomic mass (neutrons+protons it must be, so that's to distinguish isotopes).
Maybe more politicians without air would be something? :yes:
Hard to disagree with that. And it's true for both side of the pond. Irn Bru to you.
(https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/giantmug4.gif)
First, they are lower indexes - in chemistry to count atoms (ions) in a molecule. The upper right one is used for the ionisation parameter and usually has either a plus or minus in front of it.
The lower left is to count protons in the nucleus, the upper left - the atomic mass (neutrons+protons it must be, so that's to distinguish isotopes).
Please re-post that somewhere else!
Just change the "p"s to "b"s in your tags.:zzz:
A little something for your growing English lexicon.
dipstick
1. the penis
2. a stupid or obnoxious person
Shut up you sleazy dipstick.
:zzz:
Uh-huh. A poor day in Michigan? It is just that jimbro had went off his love of female attributes of the upper body direction.
dipstick
1. the penis
The things this man seeks in life...
Well he is an armchair philosopher.
If Socrates had had an armchair, he might have produced something lasting, but simple relaxation works well.
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fjaow.weebly.com%2Fuploads%2F1%2F9%2F5%2F0%2F1950309%2F9558533.jpg&hash=f74f83b23736c2e12eb552d9472eac85" rel="cached" data-hash="f74f83b23736c2e12eb552d9472eac85" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://jaow.weebly.com/uploads/1/9/5/0/1950309/9558533.jpg)
If Socrates had had an armchair, he might have produced something lasting,...
Socrates produced Plato, Aristotle, and the Socratic method. That's no small feat.
Foot binding produces small feet.
Socrates only provided the semin, his wife did the rest. (https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/broc.gif)
I'm not free in the sense that I'm slave to my physical needs.
Maybe Ersi isn't..? :)
I'm not free in the sense that I'm slave to my physical needs.
That's freedom.
The two most recent episodes of the philosophy podcast Partially Examined Life are on this topic:
Episode 103: Thoreau on Living Deliberately (http://www.partiallyexaminedlife.com/2014/10/14/episode103-thoreau/)
Episode 104: Robert Nozick's Libertarianism (http://www.partiallyexaminedlife.com/2014/10/27/ep104-nozick-libertarianism/)
Food for thought to inspire meaningful discussion.
I have read Thoreau's book. Nice to see a city guy at least to actually try "primitive" life, to get back to the roots. I personally was born in the country and I still live at the same spot where I was born. This may not seem exactly liberating, but I've always considered cities a trap, and I'm not trapped there.
I was born in a city of two million, but I only lived in a very circumscribed area that translated to a few square miles. When necessary I moved out of that area. That city today is largely horrid with the exception of an area populated by the wealthy. My brother lives in an area that is so bad that he carried a gun when he mowed his lawn.
There are hideous areas of most cities in the U.S., and I'm guessing that the same is true of all cities. Child poverty in London is scandalous. I lived in a very small city for a couple of years that was as miserable as anything I've ever seen. The city I live in today has poor areas but my area is fine. The city I'm moving to next month has wealthy folks, middle class folks and poor people. Since I enjoy the variety that cities offer, I have no problem living in them...just so long as I can avoid the down side of city life.
No symphony orchestras, ballet companies, art museums and people of all sorts in small towns.
I was born in a city of two million, but I only lived in a very circumscribed area that translated to a few square miles. When necessary I moved out of that area.
What necessitated the move?
No symphony orchestras, ballet companies, art museums and people of all sorts in small towns.
And no universities either. I had to first begin regularly going to the city when attending the high school and the university. When I was small I thought it would be cool if everything were close by to me, in the country, so I would never have to commute. But now, having graduated, I know I would not want to have nearby the kind of people who attend universities.
And no universities either.
Define small. Around here there are plenty of universities in cities of, say, 100,000 people. In America there are plenty of universities in towns made up out of less than 20-30,000, the majority of whom are students and academic personnel. More concretely, for most intents and purposes the university
is the city.
But now, having graduated, I know I would not want to have nearby the kind of people who attend universities.
Darn those kids! :lol:
And no universities either.
Universities are a fraud that slave men instead of liberating them.
I don't believe in organized teaching systems aimed to create mass production intellects with no contact whatsoever with real life.
Only a Man can teach a Man, not a system.
Universities are a fraud that slave men instead of liberating them.
I don't believe in organized teaching systems aimed to create mass production intellects with no contact whatsoever with real life.
Only a Man can teach a Man, not a system.
No women allowed?
Sir, you'd be living in relative village poverty without universities. Or in Portugal. :wine:
Sir, you'd be living in relative village poverty without universities.
:lol:
Or in Portugal.
:lol: :lol:
There's no patience. Do you know, dear ignorant, that my Country has one of the oldest and prestigious Universities in the world?? course not, you know shit but your pension at the end of the month.
Do you have one of those two doors gigantic
refrigerators? course you do...
Around here there are plenty of universities in cities of, say, 100,000 people. In America there are plenty of universities in towns made up out of less than 20-30,000, the majority of whom are students and academic personnel. More concretely, for most intents and purposes the university is the city.
That American thing would be called campus, not a city. In Europe there are university cities, which may be heavily reliant on and nurturing of their university, but there's still normal life too (production and services), not just university life.
I grew up in a town that during its best times had 1500 inhabitants. This is already big enough. It's not an insignificant town, but a municipal seat. 10,000 and more people would be oversized for me. I commute to the capital of Estonia, somewhat below half a million people, which is outrageously huge. Particularly for Estonia - about a third of the population of the whole country lives in the capital. I wish I could keep away from that place.
I grew up in a town that during its best times had 1500 inhabitants. This is already big enough. It's not an insignificant town, but a municipal seat. 10,000 and more people would be oversized for me. I commute to the capital of Estonia, somewhat below half a million people, which is outrageously huge. Particularly for Estonia - about a third of the population of the whole country lives in the capital. I wish I could keep away from that place.
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/index.php?action=reporttm;topic=61.102;msg=29545)
That's a very important statement, specially at a thread about personal freedom.
I grew up in a town that during its best times had 1500 inhabitants. This is already big enough. It's not an insignificant town, but a municipal seat. 10,000 and more people would be oversized for me. I commute to the capital of Estonia, somewhat below half a million people, which is outrageously huge. Particularly for Estonia - about a third of the population of the whole country lives in the capital. I wish I could keep away from that place.
If a city feels significantly different than a village of a couple thousand people, I call that a failure of the city. It's why e.g. Antwerp or Düsseldorf (and most Dutch cities) are nicer than Brussels and Paris. And besides, there are villages that feel much like Paris. Admittedly, it sounds like you just dislike people, period. :P
If a city feels significantly different than a village of a couple thousand people, I call that a failure of the city.
I was born just outside the town, in a real village with a dozen houses. But it's within the walking distance, and the town has everything, school and shop and doctor. And used to have more, an actual hospital, a cinema, etc.
We don't call the town village. We call the village village.
Antwerp or Düsseldorf (and most Dutch cities) are nicer than Brussels and Paris. And besides, there are villages that feel much like Paris.
I have visited the allegedly oldest city in the United States, St. Augustine, Fl. The central historical street there occasionally has a village feel, when you shut out the tourists from the mind. But it's not a genuine feel. It's a Disney village. Sometimes city architects and planners succeed like this in a craftsy artsy way. I guess it's the same in Brussels and Paris. There's a villagey spot like this in most cities, I guess.
In Tallinn, for example, there's a new high-rise area with some walking streets that feel astonishingly cozy like a living room when you are there in the middle of a summer night with no one else around. Cozy at spots when you are not watching out carefully enough.
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fnoviraplaza.ee%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2014%2F09%2Fpaev2-fixed-1024x763.jpg&hash=25cc7aaaf12a32fe36348a9592ea60ef" rel="cached" data-hash="25cc7aaaf12a32fe36348a9592ea60ef" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://noviraplaza.ee/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/paev2-fixed-1024x763.jpg)
The most important difference between a city and village is just the scale after all. I prefer to be able to walk out of the settlement and end up in nature undisturbed soon enough, instead of having to drive a hundred miles and end up in a popular beach or park or resort still full of f'n people.
Admittedly, it sounds like you just dislike people, period. :P
Of course. Don't you? What's there to like in people?
What's there to like in people?
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/index.php?action=reporttm;topic=61.105;msg=29578)
The best moments in my life happened because of people.
The worst moments because of systems with people hiding behind it.
Nice picture erski. I just love trams..... :)
is just the scale after all.
Absolutely. People and freedom are connected by a logarithm of scale.
Why is that so, it's a mystery that I keep thinking about.