Hamas, <is> the Palestinian terrorist organization that has publicly committed itself to eliminating the State of Israel.........
In the days after Hamas captured and murdered three Israeli teens and the subsequent, unfortunate murder of an Arab teen, Israel’s overtures to Hamas to de-escalate the violence were met with increased missile fire into Israel.
…..... Hamas is raining down missiles from Gaza at a rate of one every 10 minutes. Six million Israelis, comprising 75 percent of Israel’s population, are under siege. Israel is again finding it necessary to defend itself against terrorists whose agenda is to wipe the Jewish nation off the map.
........When the three Israeli teens were captured, Palestinian Arabs celebrated in the streets. When their lifeless bodies were discovered, Palestinian Arabs threw rocks at the Israeli ambulances sent to recover them.
Contrast this...... ........behavior to Israel’s response when the Arab teen was killed. The Israeli radicals were quickly arrested, and Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu called the boy’s parents to apologize. Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas has offered no condolences to the parents of the Israeli boys......
After several days of appealing to Hamas to end the violence, Israel launched [glow=green,2,300]“Operation Protective Edge” [/glow]to defend its citizens.......... The goal of the mission is to destroy Hamas’s infrastructure of rocket launchers, rocket-storage facilities, command centers, and leadership...........
While it indiscriminately fires missiles at Israeli villages, intending to kill and injure Israeli men, women, and children, Hamas continues to shield its missile launchers and weapons depots by positioning them in residential Arab homes, schools, hospitals, and mosques.
Israel takes unprecedented care to warn residents with phone calls, leaflets, and warning shots before destroying the targets..........
The questions are: Does Israel have justification
* to claim a
"Natural Right to Self-Defense" based on the
recent activity of Hamas?
Do you see the Gaza Palestinians as being just caught in the crossfire, or do they have a level of culpability?
What's your take overall?
*Noun: justification1. Something (such as a fact or circumstance) that shows an action to be reasonable or necessary2. A statement in explanation of some action or belief
If you look up "Semite", it is evident that you can be anti-semitic without taking sides.
"This is the land given to us by God." says one Semite.
"My family has lived here for a thousand years." says another Semite.
Equally, you can be pro-semitic without taking sides.
There is no answer.
Maybe I missed something, but what does that have to do with whether or not Israel has a justification in claiming a
"Natural Right to Self-Defense" based on the
recent activity of Hamas?
Or are you trying to somehow say anti-semitism doesn't exist, or matter for that fact?
On your limited terms, as soon as Israel crosses its borders, it's an attack, not self-defence. From there, they may claim whatever, but they have no right. Which of course doesn't stop them, but I'm just sticking to what's right.
Also, it's false to make the opposition to appear to be between Israel and Hamas, a state on one hand and an organisation or a political party on the other. This makes them unequal. If you insist on construing it this way and you call Hamas a terrorist organisation, then it's all the more evident that what Hamas is doing is perfectly right because terrorist organisations are supposed to terrorise. Whereas Israel is completely wrong in claiming self-defence in attacking ordinary people, hospitals and UN institutions beyond Israeli borders when they should be dealing with the members of a certain organisation.
On your limited terms, as soon as Israel crosses its borders, it's an attack, not self-defence. From there, they may claim whatever, but they have no right. Which of course doesn't stop them, but I'm just sticking to what's right.
Also, it's false to make the opposition to appear to be between Israel and Hamas, a state on one hand and an organisation or a political party on the other. This makes them unequal. If you insist on construing it this way and you call Hamas a terrorist organisation, then it's all the more evident that what Hamas is doing is perfectly right because terrorist organisations are supposed to terrorise. Whereas Israel is completely wrong in claiming self-defence in attacking ordinary people, hospitals and UN institutions beyond Israeli borders when they should be dealing with the members of a certain organisation.
Yes, Israel was taking offensive action.
The best defense is a good offense.
Rockets were raining in at the rate of 6 an hour, 24 hours a day.
Hamas was firing those rockets, therefore the only way to stop the rockets would be to attack Hamas at the positions where they deployed & fired the rockets -- at the launcher sites chosen solely by Hamas.
Hamas chose to place their rocket batteries & launchers in civilian locations in the belief that Israel would not attack them there.
They thought so dead wrong.
Israel gave plenty of notice before firing it's weapons at those locations -- via leaflets, phone calls, & warning shots.
If there were any civilian causalities, the blood is on the hands of Hamas for locating their arms, rockets launchers, supplies, & men in schools, places of worship, hotels, private homes, hospitals, etc......
In war, which this is in all but name, it's called collateral damages, & again unless Israel was to step back & accept Hamas firing those rockets into the most populated areas within it's country --- squarely at it's citizens (men, women, & children) --- the only way to stop them would be to take out those rocket supplies, & their launchers.
I wholeheartedly applaud their decision to do so, & likewise in the future if necessary, & it is truly unfortunate that Hamas chose to locate their rockets & arms in those areas putting the Palestinian people in such grave danger.
When the infantry was sent in, it was specifically assigned the duty to take out the Hamas tunnel system, which was used by Hamas to penetrate into Israel, & carry out their murderous attacks against Israeli citizens, & also to capture & hold hostage as many Israelis as they could.
The tunnels needed to be destroyed & closed once & for all.
Doing so was absolutely a defensive action --- to protect it's citizens from the Hamas attacks --- no doubt about it -- fact is fact.
No country in the world would be expected to do any less to protect the precious lives of it's people -- protect them from such relentless & ruthless attacks. The civilian causalities ... the collateral damages ... are all solely the responsibility of Hamas -- the aggressors all along, the ones who errantly decided to use the lives of the Palestinian people to hide their cowardly attacks behind.
The wise words of the former president of Iran, Ahmadinejad, comes to my mind - move the artificial country of Israel to the North Pole and everything will be alright.
The wise words of the former president of Iran, Ahmadinejad, comes to my mind - move the artificial country of Israel to the North Pole and everything will be alright.
Jews have a territory, older than the state of Israel, in a less hostile climate. It even has more area, so it's a win-win every way https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_Autonomous_Okrug
israel is bad .
hamas is more bad .
if using --lesser of two evils principle ( minus malum )
it's better to aid israel .
israel = smart + insane
hamas = stupid +insane
hamas , and their variants for somehow always have good excuses to always attack israel
Since they are (Stupid +insane )
they Always spread the Biglie technique propaganda's to increase their numbers ( Stupid people always obsessed with Majority thingy )
manipulate another people such as victim playing , drama queen , manipulate another people pity , etc .
while israel , since they are ( Smart + insane ) always have good excuses to be Compulsive and Egoistics to Bully the hamas with massive and sophisticated power + techs , etc .
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
in my point of view
Logically , that kind of warfare issues , it will easier to ask U.N assistances.
traditionally ,
US troops will go there -- blitzkrieg GAZA , then it just need to blame U.S for their effort.
:yes: easy as ABC
well,
not sure too what is the most valid and legitimate reasons about why is in the mother land of insanity ( israel-palestine ) there are infinite insanity .
but it seems , that should be arround Genetics or Environments .
-----------------------------------------
We cant solve problem with create problem for sure .
to solve a problem , it need a sollution .
so IMHO , some relevant sollutions are :
Heavily blitzkrieg their land with :
Enviromental restructuration + huge Dossages mental health care .
Hamas chose to place their rocket batteries & launchers in civilian locations in the belief that Israel would not attack them there.
I disagree a little bit. Hamas put them there precisely to point fingers at Israel for attacking those things Ersi claimed they were. However, one reason doesn't discount the other and make it incorrect. So we might both be right. In any case, it shows what filth Hamas are and why the Palestinians themselves would be better off rid of them. The people of Gaza need a real government interested in growth and development and not terrorists pretending to be government. With stability and a real government, there's instant cheap labor to build factories in Gaza and the West Bank - what jump started the Asian "Dragon" economies.
"The State of Israel ~ vs ~ Hamas ---- A "Natural Right" to Self-Defence?"
Certainly Hamas need to be locked up, but maybe also Israel.
If an intruder burgled your property and stole your television set would he be entitled to wipe out your family if you took a pot shot at him when he tried again, and again and again?
Other than noting that SF's link is inherently biased, and reminds me a great deal of my many neighbors (YAY ISRAEL! IT'S GOD'S COUNTRY AND CAN DO NO WRONG! YAY END TIMES!!!1), I agree with @Ersi's points. They were very well put, imo.
Additionally, and this is going to sound: 1) Arrogant 2) Offensive to fundie Christians 3)Commandeering
So long as we prop up the state of Israel, and there is no doubt about it, the US DOES, subsidize Israel's existence, Israel should obey most of what we tell them to do. When we tell them to quit building in the West Bank/Gaza, they should quit their illegal construction. When we tell them to quit killing innocent civilians in their counter-attacks, they should quit that.
My basis for being demanding like that is as so:
1. As noted, we prop up their economy.
2. We supply their arms, Iron Dome defense system, etc.
3. We cover their ass in int'l matters.
Don't mistake me; I love the Jewish people and made several friends from Israel whilst in Liverpool, but I hate with a passion the Israeli Gov't. The arrogant fawkers think they can do anything they want without repercussions, and I lay the blame of that squarely on us (the US).
A change of policy regarding our puppet 51st state is needed. Or, in the event that Israel chooses to ignore our directives, I say we pull the plug on funding, arms, etc. and see if they do not learn their lesson.
I agree with Norman Finkelstein on this topic. He's a Jew, so it's fair and balanced.
Israel should obey most of what we tell them to do. When we tell them to quit building in the West Bank/Gaza, they should quit their illegal construction. When we tell them to quit killing innocent civilians in their counter-attacks, they should quit that.
I agree with a lot of what you say, for I, in earlier posts in that other forum, I was probably one of the first to declare that Israel had no right to the lands inhabited for centuries by the Palestinians, & were given something that didn't belong to them by the Brits, & the US via the U.N.
But, I am also a realist. There is no backwards step regarding the State of Israel......it exists, has existed for decades, & it must be allowed/helped to continue to exist for it is paramount to our National Security Interests in that region of salivating wolves.
That's where it ends.
You're right, they must be accountable to some degree in their domestic policies .... especially in it's reconciliation with the Palestinian peoples.
Dictated to, not quite, but strongly persuaded that there's a better way of doing things, & now is the best time -- rather than never -- if they want to continue to suck on America's financial hind tit.
1. To a degree, but
persuaded rather than forced into blind political obedience.
2. Absolutely, & unequivocally.
3. Absolutely not. Israel has a perfectly sound & legitimate
"natural right to self-defense" -- to ensure the lives of their citizens are protected above
all cost ....... Collateral Damages are impossible to overcome particularly when Hamas' central plans are so insanely defective, but those plans are central to drawing on a sympathetic & compassionate external public opinion to
smokescreen their
real objectives ---- the total destruction of State of Israel, & particularly all of it's 12 million inhabitants -- every last Man, Woman, Baby, Child, Mother, Father, Grandmother & Grandfather, Uncle, Aunt, Cousin, Sister & Brother. To Hamas it's all about
location, location, location coupled with complete annihilation.Otherwise, that being said, we are probably closer to total agreement than from it. (https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/cheerskj4.gif)
Both Israel and palestine , their Societies mental health , Social Sciences and political Sciences is Questionable.
a society that have mental health issues , will born politician that have mental health issues .
politicians that have mental health issues will create an insane state .
and only politicians with psychopathy that have ideas to enlarge their land , invade another land , dominate the World , Rule the World , etc.
A change of policy regarding our puppet 51st state is needed. Or, in the event that Israel chooses to ignore our directives, I say we pull the plug on funding, arms, etc. and see if they do not learn their lesson.
You're wrong about the relationship.
The de facto state of affairs, if not de jure, is that the US is a vassal of Israel. Why? US politicians have made it such.
Watch any address of the Israeli PM to the US congress. You will see the congressmen wildly cheering and applauding as if its a personal visitation by the Messiah. No one, not even any president gets that response.
See the latest - where we have congressmen and senators lining up and fighting to show they are more pro-Israel than anyone else.
Israel wants more money for Iron Dome? No problem. This usual dysfunctional congress suddenly woke up, like a Vampire from its grave at night, and instantly passed a $225 million appropriation for Iron Dome. Two days later the bill was signed by the president.
Compare that to Sandy aid to the Northeast. Congress was hedging and delaying until the Northeast congress critters reminded other regions that they have been previous recipient of much Federal aid when they needed it. For Israel there is no hedging.
At the State Department we used to predict that if Israel's prime minister should announce that the world is flat, within 24 hours Congress would pass a resolution congratulating him on the discovery."- A CHANGING IMAGE, Richard H. Curtiss Foreign Service Officer
Israel has been as usual so arrogant and well over the top in it's response to Hamas. One woman from the Strip I watched being interviewed on television. She was an intelligent woman and has no time for Hamas at all but as she commented all Israel has done is lay more generations to be in the face with Israel.
Anyway on a more direct matter Israel is utterly way out in their actions. Can I remind everyone that Israel dominates Hamas on just about everything - tanks, artillery, etc. It also has that iron shield they proudly boast of so there is no way on Earth anyone can say Israel was under threat of being destroyed.None at all and the Hamas missiles are being knocked out before they can do much aginst a heavy army like Israel's The slaughter of well into four figures, cutting water and electricity is disgusting and nasty. So always having the upper hand the Israeli jackboots are more than a match for the opposition. A tiny handful of Jewish civilians killed is a good excuse to unleash such a military force? Having taken out the tunnels and with the ant-missile shield there is no comparison yet they fall back on Old testament attitudes and slaughter the innocents and are getting away with it.
So with a heavier presence Israel has been an arrogant, immoral in an unequal contestant and will get away with it because the West bows to the "leader" because of the massive Jewish lobby on the Hill and the armaments industry. Tel Aviv spokespeople insult the intelligence that it is unfortunate innocents die. Compared to Israeli civilian deaths it is a damnable disgrace. Hospitals over-run by the injured, medical supplies stretched you cannot even play on a beach as a child. Small wonder the Israeli President had to apologise for that one and there is nowhere to be safe in that tight Gaza Strip no matter what the blitreigers in Tel Aviv say. The siege has lasted too long and the economy devastated as well Yet the paymasters in DC let them away with it.
Damnable is too light a description.
the US is a vassal of Israel. Why? US politicians have made it such.
Hmm, the US a vassal of Israel?
Admitting that you are right - why US politicians have made it such?
You don't do something without reason. Do you?
Two outstanding facts krake in my wee intervention here.
The first is the extent of fundamental Christians who have this overdrawn view of Israel due to it's part in the faith. This has led to an unfortunate attitude just because of what the country was in Biblical times. Secondly the massive strength of the Jewish lobby which I touched on in the USA. That is both political and financial. It is no surprise therefore that US Presidents are almost obliged to speak at a Jewish Conference due to that partisan ethnic/religious corner's power.
It is as I simply portrayed a nonsense to assume that a powerful military like Israel's and Amas are somehow equal in their warfare. Having destroyed much of Gaza in a so-called sorting out of tunnels and rockets the economy of the Strip was destroyed. Egypt shuts one side and Israel surrounds the rest including coast and it is a damnable intolerance and disgusting matter that the Tel Aviv regime gets away with this simply because the US and Israel are so far up each other there is an echo. If anyone else did this the US would be rumbling into action. No-one can claim this is some sort of reasonable attrition by the Israelis is off their sensible grey cells. When one looks at the number of Israeli civilians killed to the mass number of the same group in the Gaza Strip there is no comparison whatsoever. What makes it more terribly farcical is that the damn rockets fired by Hamas hardly do anything due to excellent shield provided by their pals in the Pentagon
Has Israel had 400 children killed in this latest event? Has it had 2,000 iilled altother? Nope a handful outside of the military. That same military can get away with about anything and even when they are shown to be criminally brutal the regular government spoesman will say anything dodgy will be investigated is a cruel joke.
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FMr1Z2Yy.gif&hash=a48b506adbc3826c2057c30fc6c6ddc5" rel="cached" data-hash="a48b506adbc3826c2057c30fc6c6ddc5" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://i.imgur.com/Mr1Z2Yy.gif)
Not too long ago someone made a brilliant statement:
"....when the Palestinian people start loving their children more than the hate us, there will be peace".Sound like a simple request? No?
Will they ever find this love, or does Islam only teach them that hatred is their only motivation for existence?
....Compared to Israeli civilian deaths it is a damnable disgrace.....
...... When one looks at the number of Israeli civilians killed to the mass number of the same group in the Gaza Strip there is no comparison whatsoever. What makes it more terribly farcical is that the damn rockets fired by Hamas hardly do anything due to excellent shield provided by their pals in the Pentagon....
So, Israel should close down their
"Iron Dome", & let the rockets rain in, & then allow Hamas to freely flow in & out at will to kill it's citizens until the numbers satisfy you & the rest of the bleeding-heart world???
When Hamas grows some balls & remove their people, arms, rockets & the like from heavily populated civilian areas, less civilians will die. The responsibility rests squarely on Hamas' shoulders --- nowhere else.
Israel is responding to it's people's desperate needs/cries for help..........the need to be protected from Hamas.....period.
When the toll hits 5,000 then maybe the bleeding-hearts will remove their collective heads out of their bloody assholes long enough to see that if nothing else their cries for so called fairness in the death toll does nothing but embolden Hamas & their likes!
In war -- & if you think this isn't war, wise up & look again -- you'd gladly take out 1,000 of theirs --- men, women, & children --- to save a dozen of your own, or would you RJ -- would you let them kill you & yours out of your so called
respect for fairness?
Well, it's been that way since the earliest times, & will be that way 'till the end of days.
Nothing is more important than the lives of your own........nothing.
My guess - at the end Mr Netanyahu will agree with the USA on a two-state solution.
(https://matrixbob.files.wordpress.com/2014/07/two-state-solutiuon.jpg)
that's the Warzone , migrate from there is the most logical thing to do .
there is no someone that point a gun to stay or live in Gaza .
or is there ? :left:
My guess - at the end Mr Netanyahu will agree with the USA on a two-state solution.
(https://matrixbob.files.wordpress.com/2014/07/two-state-solutiuon.jpg)
At least Hamas won't be able to easily spread any rocket launchers among them.
......migrate from there is the most logical thing to do .
And throw all those hard workin', overachieving Islamic terrorists out of work, & worse yet, nothing to bitch about either!!??
seriously , no joke .
why is Palestine People stay in GAza ?
they know that is a land of War .
They know Hamas hide there .
they Know israel will Blitzkrieg Gaza .
but they still live there ?
is there are no place beside 'Gaza' to live a life in Palestine ?
Yer guess is as good as mine ......... Try This (http://bit.ly/XUgL2V)
Oh dear oh dear SmileyFaze. Your neo-con lunacy that bestrides much of America is still to the fore. Where did I suggest that Israel should take out it's Iron Dome??
Do try and understand what IS going on. Israel is a modern military system country. It has planes, latest missiles, tanks, etc. Hamas has mortars and rockets and there is absolutely no comparison at all - no equality of arms whatsover and something obvious to an immature adult as. In addition where should all the innocents go in this blitzreig by the ME Reich? The Strip is small and crammed. Power and water are now problems due to the heavy one-sdied military situation (oh andI forgot when mentioned Israeli weaponry to include their H bomb stuff). Now the storm troopers have killed 2,000 including 400 children so what is the equivalent re Israeli civilians? You fine well know the answer. And having dealt with the tunnels what is next? One Tel Aviv government fool has suggested some form o near concentration camp situation. Will the disgusting sigee of this almost destroyed Strip have the sieg lifted?
Israel gets away with this because of it's suck to the USA. If America thinks it is right then stuff everyone else. You supply the Tel aviv jackboots with expensive weapons (thanks dear military corporates) and having destroyed Gaza you same lot will then spend billions in the rebuilding. Nut jobs is too simple a description. In this daft and immoral situation you waste buckets of money when tens of millions of Americans are scared to be ill are poor and almost left to rot - or look for charity. I have even seen news reports including camps set up by ex-colonists and all through no fault of your own. Immoral stances are understood in the world except in the one nation that thinks it is "it." Not only do the Jews have big political pull in America but in Wall street so hardly surprising they pull the DC strings. I know you can afford a head shrinker but millions can't.
Methinks RJ's tune would change dramatically if someone started taking potshots at his home. Then, I doubt that which side has heavier armaments would matter much-- somebody is shooting at him and that needs to be stopped!
To me, it looks like the same kind of deal here. Hamas fires missiles at Israel and doesn't expect Israel to-- er, I don't know-- ahhh-- shoot back? Further, Hamas hides its weapons in civilian sectors so Israel has to kill civilians to stop Hamas from killing Israeli civilians. Sorta like the bully who picks on other children, then the instant trouble comes a-callin' the bully hides behind a girl's skirts. Can't hit back at the bully without hitting the girl. Real brave there, eh, Hamas?
Look, if you want an all-around bad guy, it's hard to find one nastier than Hamas right now. Start trouble, then use civilians as human shields-- they really don't give a (bless and do not curse) about the Palestinians, frankly Hamas wouldn't care if every Palestinian was reduced to corpses-- they just want to annihilate Israel.
Methinks RJ's tune would change dramatically if someone started taking potshots at his home. Then, I doubt that which side has heavier armaments would matter much-- somebody is shooting at him and that needs to be stopped!
To me, it looks like the same kind of deal here. Hamas fires missiles at Israel and doesn't expect Israel to-- er, I don't know-- ahhh-- shoot back? Further, Hamas hides its weapons in civilian sectors so Israel has to kill civilians to stop Hamas from killing Israeli civilians. Sorta like the bully who picks on other children, then the instant trouble comes a-callin' the bully hides behind a girl's skirts. Can't hit back at the bully without hitting the girl. Real brave there, eh, Hamas?
Look, if you want an all-around bad guy, it's hard to find one nastier than Hamas right now. Start trouble, then use civilians as human shields-- they really don't give a (bless and do not curse) about the Palestinians, frankly Hamas wouldn't care if every Palestinian was reduced to corpses-- they just want to annihilate Israel.
Now, ain't that the truth!!! Well said!!! (https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/clapping.gif)
Now, it looked like RJ was going to say something new, & possibly interesting too. (https://www.smileyfaze.tk/smileys/yikes.png)
Oh dear oh dear SmileyFaze. Your neo-con lunacy that bestrides much of America is still to the fore.........
(https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/BlaBlaBlaBla.gif)
(https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/BlaBlaBlaBla.gif)
(https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/BlaBlaBlaBla.gif)
(https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/BlaBlaBlaBla.gif)
(https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/BlaBlaBlaBla.gif)
(https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/BlaBlaBlaBla.gif)
(https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/BlaBlaBlaBla.gif)
(https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/BlaBlaBlaBla.gif)
(https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/BlaBlaBlaBla.gif)
(https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/BlaBlaBlaBla.gif)
Tisk ... Tisk ...... I was so, so wrong... (https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/yawning003.gif)
Has Israel had 400 children killed in this latest event? Has it had 2,000 iilled altother? Nope a handful outside of the military
Did Israel act like a bunch of little bitches hiding their weapons in civilian neighborhood, knowing that will get innocent people killed? I have to wonder of the Palestinians wouldn't have their state already, if not for Hamas. Today Israel and Hamas signed a three day truce. Let's see how long it takes for Hamas to break it.
The U.S. intends to continue bombing targets in Iraq.
Wouldn't it be more convenient to sub-contract the job to Israel?
Israel should obey most of what we tell them to do. When we tell them to quit building in the West Bank/Gaza, they should quit their illegal construction. When we tell them to quit killing innocent civilians in their counter-attacks, they should quit that.
I agree with a lot of what you say, for I, in earlier posts in that other forum, I was probably one of the first to declare that Israel had no right to the lands inhabited for centuries by the Palestinians, & were given something that didn't belong to them by the Brits, & the US via the U.N.
But, I am also a realist. There is no backwards step regarding the State of Israel......it exists, has existed for decades, & it must be allowed/helped to continue to exist for it is paramount to our National Security Interests in that region of salivating wolves.
That's where it ends.
You're right, they must be accountable to some degree in their domestic policies .... especially in it's reconciliation with the Palestinian peoples.
Dictated to, not quite, but strongly persuaded that there's a better way of doing things, & now is the best time -- rather than never -- if they want to continue to suck on America's financial hind tit.
1. To a degree, but persuaded rather than forced into blind political obedience.
2. Absolutely, & unequivocally.
3. Absolutely not. Israel has a perfectly sound & legitimate "natural right to self-defense" -- to ensure the lives of their citizens are protected above all cost ....... Collateral Damages are impossible to overcome particularly when Hamas' central plans are so insanely defective, but those plans are central to drawing on a sympathetic & compassionate external public opinion to smokescreen their real objectives ---- the total destruction of State of Israel, & particularly all of it's 12 million inhabitants -- every last Man, Woman, Baby, Child, Mother, Father, Grandmother & Grandfather, Uncle, Aunt, Cousin, Sister & Brother. To Hamas it's all about location, location, location coupled with complete annihilation.
Otherwise, that being said, we are probably closer to total agreement than from it. (https://www.smileyfaze.tk/slides/cheerskj4.gif)
You seem to misunderstand me a bit, but I am glad we agree on most of this.
1. I have no problems with Israel's existence. Though some of how it came to be is a tad illegal, most of it was done legally (land sold, etc).
2. I would never demand absolute political obedience, but it appears to me that the Israeli gov't thinks that the US taxpayer-funded cash is an entitlement to the state of Israel. As we both know, it is not. My solution? For every time they try to shirk the direction we are prodding them in, we make a cut to some form of funding. Massive cuts to the subsidies of the IDF would of course be most effective, but no one in DC has the balls to do that. Nearly all are cowards. The only cut I could ever envision would be to the Israeli economy, i.e. our propping up of it.
3. Glad to see our agreement, once again, regarding illegal construction.
4. Once again, as I have, in the past, harped on ad nauseum on D&D, what with the generous welfare packages we offer Israel (while US infrastructure continues to be neglected, I might add, as well as some of our own ppl going hungry), none are more generous than the Iron Dome we gifted them. It will ensure that 90% of rockets are destroyed.
- Also, if they want self-defense, I am not against it. I am against waste. I can see limited value in what is going on now (destruction of tunnels w/ cash we gave the Palestinians) with the value being them destroyed, but if they want protection, then send out 100-200 of their pissed-off Givati Brigade to end Hamas' leadership once and for all.
--To a degree, I understand why they are not doing my above suggestion. Every single President from Coolidge onward has betrayed our nation by allowing the Saud family to continue to draw air. They are the most despicable form of human being alive, and have funded our enemies since their inception in 1925. AND WHAT TO WE DO? WE CRAWL INTO BED WITH THEM! What does that bring us? 3000 dead on 9/11/2001; the funding of ISIL in the former colonial construct known as Iraq, etc. Our response? Crawl ever further into bed with them, though they appear to be pissed at Obama. It's one of the few things Obama has done right, pissing those parasites off. Salafi Islam must be eliminated. I wouldn't be against posthumous and current charges of treason against every president since Coolidge up to the current failure of an incumbent for such a huge betrayal to our country. / end rant
Yer guess is as good as mine ......... Try This (http://bit.ly/XUgL2V)
That thing, is full of The Big lie techniques , disinformations , propagandas , etc .
I guess a Neutral Sources is much better than Search engines .
not to mention , Wrong information is more dangerous than, do not know any information.
frankly Hamas wouldn't care if every Palestinian was reduced to corpses-- they just want to annihilate Israel.
I don't exactly know what Hamas wants and what it cares about. Fact is that Hamas will neither annihilate Israel with those missiles (btw, does anybody know how many Israelis have been killed by those missiles since the first one was fired and till now?) nor will it stop Israel to build new settlements on grabbed land.
Israeli Settlements on Palestinian Land (http://www.ifamericansknew.org/stat/settlements.html)
Land and Settlement Issues (https://www.globalpolicy.org/security-council/index-of-countries-on-the-security-council-agenda/israel-palestine-and-the-occupied-territories/land-and-settlement-issues.html)
Land grabbing continues as I am typing this post.
Who knows what the endgame of Hamas is. Their shelling early Sunday morning prevented Israeli humanitarian aid and supplies from reaching Gaza from the Kerem Shalom Crossing. Maybe they have no plan and are just lunatics. I think the best outcome would for the Palestinians themselves to overthrow them.
I don't exactly know what Hamas wants and what it cares about.
They wrote it all down in 32 articles of Mein Kampfish genocidal lunacy.
btw, does anybody know how many Israelis have been killed by those missiles since the first one was fired and till now?
Israel builds bomb shelters to protect its citizens. Hamas builds tunnels to carry out attacks. The number of civilian deaths will therefore be disproportionate, and Israel (mostly) cannot be blamed for it.
Israel builds bomb shelters to protect its citizens.
And grabs land ...
The number of civilian deaths will therefore be disproportionate, and Israel (mostly) cannot be blamed for it.
What do you mean by disproportionate - 1:1000, 1:2000, 1: ....?
You know mjsmsprt40 and SmileyFaze you are both too typical of the wide attitude brained into you over there on israel and excellently validate my opion. As for me not saying anything new - neither have you but too blind to see it. If America does something it is automatically correct and if anyone else beyond the pale. Talk about propaganda. Instead of mmubling the usual neo-con and daft stuff you should have read properly what I said.
There is NO comparison between Hamas (which i do not support) and the IDF is there?? How many Israeli civilians are dead compared to those in the Gaza Strip? Compare the armaments as well. This is a simple as it can become. You are both typical of the ne-con and fundamental Christians who think because this is the Holy land are somehow Israel is right. Biblically not true and the American fundie religious attitude gets carried away. So you both emphasise in your pro-Israel stance my argument. Israel will therefore get away with it's blitzkreig attitudes because of the mistaken religious attitude and because Jews control so much in America whether media, film world, whatever (oh and economics)
I regret that Israel was ever created because they stole land and evicted people who had lived there for centuries trying to fall back on old testament attitudes (which are false today) . The power of Jewish people in America made sure the Jews got what they wanted. However the place exists so stuck with it but what right does Israel have to block Palestine from being a proper State when it created it's on the back of terrorist just as bad as Hamas? Jewish terrorists like the Stern Gang and others wreaked havoc to create the State and stuffed anyone else. They get away with anything including their secret service stealing British and Australian passports for their secret police to murder people. In a sense I am not surprised at suck negatives from you two as you are brained into this attitude and that America is the world's inspiration, loight in darkness and any other nonsense.
So Israel exists and ids a twin with the US so gets away with anything it likes. Instead of trying to ignore my direct answer try and look balanced at the two sides namely Israel and Hamas. It is NOT equal and neither is the savage destruction of the Strip morally justified.
And grabs land ...
I do not believe they are illegal; for starters most of them were already settled before the Arab aggression in 1948 destroyed the settlements. The Barrier is a different issue. The West Bank should be open for Jews and Arabs alike according to international law.
What do you mean by disproportionate - 1:1000, 1:2000, 1: ....?
I was under the impression it was around 1:10 over the years, but you clearly have different sources. I've been unable to quickly find data from the Palestine Red Crescent Society. But, simply put, Israel could wipe Palestine from the face of the earth if they wanted to. Clearly killing civilians is not their intent. If Hamas were Israel, there would be no more Jews.
Has Israel had 400 children killed in this latest event? Has it had 2,000 iilled altother? Nope a handful outside of the military
Did Israel act like a bunch of little bitches hiding their weapons in civilian neighborhood, knowing that will get innocent people killed? I have to wonder of the Palestinians wouldn't have their state already, if not for Hamas. Today Israel and Hamas signed a three day truce. Let's see how long it takes for Hamas to break it.
I understand the GAZA population density is similar to an American city. The whole area is like a city.
Which brings up the problem, where are weapons supposed to be hidden? In armories? I doubt Israel would allow Hamas to create and keep armories. In police stations? To have weapons concentrated in police stations would make it very easy for Israel to confiscate them.
So enlighten me where you think the weapons should be kept.
During the American revolution, I'm sure the British said the same about American "terrorist." Look at those "terrorists" hiding their weapons in their houses. When they formed their militias, those colonial terrorists actually brought their muskets from their farmhouses instead of keeping them stockpiled in armories as decent armies do. Did you consider the American revolutionaries, who kept their weapons at home, little bitches?
..........Which brings up the problem, where are weapons supposed to be hidden? In armories? I doubt Israel would allow Hamas to create and keep armories. In police stations? To have weapons concentrated in police stations would make it very easy for Israel to confiscate them.
So enlighten me where you think the weapons should be kept..........
Well, the premise is that if you fire unguided rockets indiscriminately, on the average of 6 an hour, at over 80% of Israel's population with the sole purpose of annihilating Israel's civilian population (men, women, children, babies, grandmothers, grandfathers....etc....etc...) you
forfeit any & all rights to any & all offensive weapons, & wherever they are located they need to be hunted out & destroyed.
Hamas has brought down the hammers of hell upon themselves, & in doing so upon the unfortunate civilians whose skirts these cowards were hiding behind!
The only option that will guarantee the safety of the people they pretend to represent, their human shields, is if they unilaterally call an unconditional permanent ceasefire......stop all hostilities, stop all the rockets, & stop all their raids into Israel....permanently.....period.
If one wishes to make war, one must be willing to accept causalities.
The only alternative is peace, but to get it you have to be willing to make it.
....During the American revolution, I'm sure the British said the same about American "terrorist." Look at those "terrorists" hiding their weapons in their houses. When they formed their militias, those colonial terrorists actually brought their muskets from their farmhouses instead of keeping them stockpiled in armories as decent armies do. Did you consider the American revolutionaries, who kept their weapons at home, little bitches?......
There is no possible comparison whatsoever between the Cowardly Hamas of 2014, & the American Patriots of 1776 ...... None whatsoever.
....During the American revolution, I'm sure the British said the same about American "terrorist." Look at those "terrorists" hiding their weapons in their houses. When they formed their militias, those colonial terrorists actually brought their muskets from their farmhouses instead of keeping them stockpiled in armories as decent armies do. Did you consider the American revolutionaries, who kept their weapons at home, little bitches?......
There is no possible comparison whatsoever between the Cowardly Hamas of 2014, & the American Patriots of 1776 ...... None whatsoever.
I'm not the one who made the connection between hiding weapons at home and "cowardly little bitches."
I know the American revolutionaries were not cowardly. You should not assume the Hamas terrorists or freedom fighters are also cowardly. For Hamas, the easy, lucrative and comfortable thing would be to make an "accommodation" with the US and Israel. You'll then see the US government flying in tons of 100 dollar bills to personally give to Hamas leaders. That's what we did for the warlords in Afghanistan when they reached an "accomodation" with us.
http://www.thetower.org/article/why-everything-reported-from-gaza-is-crazy-twisted/
I'm not the one who made the connection between hiding weapons at home and "cowardly little bitches."
In the American revolution, many patriots had to bring their own gun. They were not hiding weapons at home. When they were not deployed they brought their guns home as their personal property. Even civilians had to have their guns ready in case of British invasion. This is a far cry from firing missiles from densely populated areas, knowing full well it will get their own people killed and injured when Israel has no option but to strike back. Do note, however, that the American did have armories - in military camps and forts well away from the civilians. In fact, one of the first things the British did as war became inevitable was to try to raid the American armories. Who warped your mind that the American Patriots were anything like Hamas, the animals send suicide bombers into a crowd of people. I must now offer an apology to animals for comparing them to Hamas when, in fact, Hamas are worse than animals. Animals kill to eat and to defend themselves. Hamas kills innocent civilians for no reason with no apparent objective but cold-blooded murder. Hell, I even told you they fired missiles to prevent aid from reaching the Palestinians.
Hamas are no longer freedom fighters, if they ever were which is questionable. They're terrorists. If the Palestinian people do get their own sovereign country, I'd bet my life savings on them continuing their terrorism. The Palestinians worst enemy is not Israel, it's Hamas and their filthy ilk.
it seems israel-palestine traditional conflitcs are become the World issues .
let's get this straight ..
correct me if i maybe wrong ..
Israel , spread their Propagandas and get something to leech is from Western , europes , to murica .
while palestine , spread their propagandas and get something to leech from eastern , arabs , until my motherland .
They Split the World in two mainstream .
Both are leechs , and both using that funds to fite one each other , again and again , and again , and again ...
isn't that so fabulous ? :coffee:
Perhaps a wee bit of an over simplification Sparta but you do have something there.
Hamas kills innocent civilians for no reason with no apparent objective but cold-blooded murder.
There's nothing "apparent" about it. Look up a summary of the contents of their charter (Wikipedia will do).
Surely if one had to compare the Israel/Palestinian conflict with the American Continent, it would be more correct to compare the British against the indigenous Indians and, after them, the Americans against the Indigenous Indians (and, to be pedantic, the Spanish and Portuguese against the Indians); land stolen from its owners and atrocities from both sides after that.
Surely if one had to compare the Israel/Palestinian conflict with the American Continent, it would be more correct to compare the British against the indigenous Indians and, after them, the Americans against the Indigenous Indians (and, to be pedantic, the Spanish and Portuguese against the Indians); land stolen from its owners and atrocities from both sides after that.
To a degree I agree, but for the last sentence:
"....land stolen from its owners..." The peoples who inhabited The Americas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_North_America) prior to European Colonizations were migrants themselves, from Asia it has been determined, about 15,000 - 40,000 years prior to the European exploration & subsequent settlement(s). To say that these prior inhabitants were
"owners of the land" would be incorrect. Nobody
actually owned the land. Every culture that inhabited the land migrated to it, settling on the land. The land never had any ownership, just long term claims by long term migratory inhabitants. Therefore the lands could never have been
"stolen from anyone" in the true sense, just one group of settlers displacing previous group(s) of settlers via various means & methods -- via exchange of values at one end to violent warfare at the other, with degrees of peaceful cohabitation spread throughout the middle.
In the end the land has no true owners, & never will, only temporary tenants who hold claims, which are -- & will always be -- subject to dispute.
Europeans >< indians
is more like , cross cultures -- Lost in translation issues .
Europes , westerns , etc .
their cultures , traditions , systems , etc are built by structuralists .
it is for somehow forces everyone who live in that territories to obey certain rules or laws , to run the system.
Westerns governments are smooth criminals .
while ancient indians , do not have any complicated systems ( Anarchy )
when a Society like indians , meet another society that have greater power ,
and somehow there are conflicts .
that society will face extinction.
that is happened ,
Simply , because they do not force their people to pay taxes .
Taxes are used to build Power .
Without Power , nothing can survive .
well,
that are alot of Fe's :beard:
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mememaker.net%2Fstatic%2Fimages%2Ftemplates%2F1601327.jpg&hash=e6720df89b0e98cb7690eb3a0f01bbee" rel="cached" data-hash="e6720df89b0e98cb7690eb3a0f01bbee" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://www.mememaker.net/static/images/templates/1601327.jpg)
As Bibi just recently formed a new coalition (by a knife's edge and with one hour to go), I look forward to reading SF's thoughts on this, and if the Coalition for the Israeli Gov't will last? Also, I note the composition of the Coalition is hard-right, in general, which most likely doesn't bode will for any two-state solution, or am I wrong?
Thx in advance, SF! :beer:
Israel is a rogue State if ever there was one. It only exists due to the US taxpayer, American fundamentalists still living in a past long one. We are constantly told about how wonderful Israel is as a democratic country and all the usual Zionist myths and lies. On the old Opera forums I mentioned much of the clandestine stuff it gets involved in and even amongst it's own people. Stealing British, Australian passports for agents to use to go and kill someone the actions of it's armies against the occupied and so on. It is dying to have a go at Iran and maybe it should and then get it's come comeuppance as it is overdue. Soldiers who misuse their authority, act horribly and kill large numbers of the incontinent. That neo-fascist Israel refuses to recognise a homeland for Palestinians is yet another joke on the word 'democracy' or rights. I also detailed how Israel internally treated Ethiopian Jews as something to be kept at the end of a pole and Christians sometimes get that too.
All the buk about Iran H bombs but Israel and America keeps silent on what Israel has. The Zionists demand that all the land they are is illegally is theirs as it was theirs 3,000 years ago. Their spiritually however is a bit of something else when one considers that they were to be put out for ever! They are no fifferent from the 3rd Reich of the 1930's in land expansion, invading, refusing to give up territory that is not theirs. Of course they get away with it becausehey US is so far up their behind. If ever a showdown came and that damn arrogant country was on the verge of collapse what great news that would be. And you know what? America would cobble together some excuse and make their nonsense about rights and freedoms even more ludicrous.
How many terrorists were killed in the dreadful attack on Gaza? We know fine well it was the civilians who took the brunt in such an overcrowded place and on top of that the Jews hem the place in along the coast as well. It is a despicable, Zionist place that misuses Old Testament and European history and time and time again gets off with anything it does because of the veto exercised in their favour at the UN Security Council. Blotzreigs, Gestapo style secret actions, assassinations, lies. Yeah maybe in hindsight Europe has an influence! Dam the country.
I have to agree that killing someone because he is incontinent is hard to defend.
Soldiers who misuse their authority, act horribly and kill large numbers of the incontinent.
I tried very hard and came up with nothing.
I tried this...
late 14c., "wanting in self restraint," from Old French incontinent, from Latin incontinentem (nominative incontinens) "incontinent, immoderate, intemperate," from in- "not, opposite of" (see in- (1)) + continens (see continent ). Originally chiefly of sexual appetites; sense of "unable to control bowels or bladder" first attested 1828.
...and that didn't help.
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fblogs.mydevstaging.com%2Fblogs%2Fgreat-expectations%2Ffiles%2F2012%2F10%2Fshutterstock_86968778-258x300.jpg&hash=379d57253f84648febe108e46d58d25d" rel="cached" data-hash="379d57253f84648febe108e46d58d25d" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://blogs.mydevstaging.com/blogs/great-expectations/files/2012/10/shutterstock_86968778-258x300.jpg)
Howie's even older than I thought… Or less educated. (Is that even possible? :) ) But his prejudices run deep!
"It's the Joos…" explains all the world's problems, for some.
I liked what Jimmy "J.J." Walker said long ago: "Look at Ireland. No Jews, no blacks; and still they find something to kill each other over… White people are creative!"
I suppose I am in continent. I hope it helps.
Shows how much you know Oakdale and that isn't much so easy to work you out. And as for Ireland racism is active there too.
On that rogue haven of Zionism it shows the propaganda we get about how wonderful Israel is even though it acts like a ME imperialist. It doesn't think the Palestinians should be allowed a State and how arrogant is that one? okay for them but not someone else. The number of times their military has acted wrongly is a long list. The country treats Jews from places it is not keen on like rubbish and gets away with anything thanks to it's US funders. Throw in stealing land, misusing people and restricting their rights and we see another typical hypocrisy. If it does not suit the ex-colonists on this forum then you get a label and the Jews get away with murder - practically too. Maybe one day the place might be more honest about it's own H bomb matter hbut don't hold the proverbial breath.
There is no country more up the mental arse of Israel than America but there again all the hype from fundamentalist Christians plus the Jewish influenced media and the money barons explains much. Maybe Israel should attack Iran and then we might get rid of the damn Zionist control freaks.
And as for Ireland racism is active there too.
Oh? What
races are there
there? Do tell! :)
Why you shouldn't watch so much TV:
If anyone needs further evidence of why the news agencies often can’t be trusted to report accurately on Israel and the Palestinians, and why major news outlets such as the New York Times and the BBC should stop repeating agency copy without verifying it, here is an important example from this weekend.
According to Italian and Spanish news outlets and according to the Vatican’s own website, Pope Francis told Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas that he could be an angel of peace. “May you be an angel of peace,” he urged Abbas, effectively saying that if Abbas would take the decision to accept one of the peace offers that various Israeli prime ministers have made to him, or at least make a serious counter-offer, he could be an angel of peace. The pope did not say that Abbas – infamous for ordering the Munich Olympic massacre, among many other atrocities – was “an angel of peace.”
(source (http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/media-gets-pope-s-abbas-comments-wrong_948653.html#))
I plead with you,
Howie, to take the poor decades-long "displaced" Palestinians into
your large and largely unpopulated northern part of the major British isle, since their Arab neighbors -even after concerted "efforts" by the U.N.- seem continually uninterested in their plight!
Surely, they are culturally and politically
simpatico! (How -exactly- I don't know… But I could expound a likely scenario, if you asked nicely! :) ) And your "nation"'s birth-rate requires some propping up, no? :)
The piece ends:
Meanwhile the website of the official Radio Vatican doesn’t even report on the Pope’s angels comment at all, apparently judging it unimportant.
Former Middle East reporters such as myself (“The Case of Reuters”) and Matti Friedman (who used to work at AP’s Jerusalem bureau) have long warned about the impartiality of the major news agencies coverage of the Middle East.
But then too often do reporters and editors at the New York Times, BBC, and elsewhere seem to be happy reporting on what they want to hear, rather than on what was actually said or done, when it comes to the Palestinians and Israel.
(I expect few to read a whole article, or to honestly parse what their
tellies and favorite
newspapers tell them… So: I post the last few paragraphs too.)
What about the odyssey of the Palestinians is not understood — by everyone who's given it any thought?
———————————————————————————————————
Just in case you missed it: "the impartiality of the major news agencies coverage of the Middle East" means "the partiality of
etc.…". What prompts such, propels it, and
purifies it, as a
liberal trope does indeed mystify me…
As you are a Yank Oakdale, I will understand that you don't know much about the outside world. Racism does exist in places like Dublin and regarding immigrants. Racism also exists in your pal Israel and I raised that in the Opera and this Forum. Now being a non-Jew and living in the 4th ME Reich and citizenship is a struggle. Even Jews who are non-white can be added. Zionism is flourishing in the country but overlooked by the land of the free and home of the brave.
Racism does exist in places like Dublin and regarding immigrants.
Yes. I've heard tell they let in Scots, and
vice versa! Silly people… :)
Racism also exists in your pal Israel […]
Are the Jews and Arabs (and Ethiopians) not
human? (If you prick them, do they not bleed? Etc.) Racism is a human fault, as wide-spread as Man himself.
Now being a non-Jew and living in the 4th ME Reich and citizenship is a struggle.
Yes: Civil rights, an economy that rewards initiative and talent, the vote and representation in various levels of government and judiciary! Sounds very Nazi-like to a Scot like you … does it?
Why?
Perhaps you just prefer the Stalinist mode!? :)
'Ever pricked a dog? :left:
Perhaps you just prefer the Stalinist mode!? :)
Careful Oak!
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fi1.wp.com%2Fbigamericannews.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2014%2F09%2Fqueenholdingaguninacar.jpg&hash=2483627d0d9e324afbb85a7c51071139" rel="cached" data-hash="2483627d0d9e324afbb85a7c51071139" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://i1.wp.com/bigamericannews.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/queenholdingaguninacar.jpg)
I don't think the Queen Mum would take me out… (But even she were about to, I'd make the time to apologize for Barack Obama's "gifts" to her, shortly after he became president — but already after he'd reached his stride!)
You can actually be amusing Oakdale. When it comes to national racism who can beat America? Right from the start and that wee bit of paper for rights and such it was only legal for whites. Racism was endemic. You had an army during WW2 which had to have Apartheid to avoid white going daft being with blacks. If it was not so serious it would be amusing fighting racist Nazis. Even today race is a nation-wide matter in cities, work, police and much else. At the last Presidential farce race was a national issue. Not surprised your israeli pals often exercise their own racial matters and it is a close pals act between the USA and Zionist land. Israel only exists with US taxpaters dish outs and military hardware support. On the other side of the coin so much of the corporate control and media in the US is Jewish involved.
For all your guff about rights, freedoms and all the usual baloney Israel gets away with anything because it knows the US will exercise a veto at the UN. That the Palestinians cannot have a proper State is a damn disgrace and you lot with all your keech about rights and freedoms are a disgrace. Israel steals land, evicts people from their homes and farms it even persecutes Jews from Africa,etc. The two of you do have something very deeply in common - hypocrisy. The Protocols of Zion may well have been daft but the bosom pals between nut job land and the Zionistist is a damn dangerous partnership.
When it comes to national racism who can beat America?
England — later called Great Britain. Certainly! But you, boy-o don't like history.
Sobeit.
Many others come to mind. But -at present- I'll only deal with the hypocrites-in-chief! Since one of their most minor minions is prosecuting…
———————————————————————————————
A thought occurs to me: When that author mentioned "Wee Willie Winkie" was he perhaps referring to the Scots incompetent manhood? :)
Howie, keep it in your pants! Or make good use of it. Stop jerking off in public — you're embarrassing everyone.
(Well, not everyone: Some revel in your comeuppance. You knew that, right?)
Is it your contention, that America invented Racism? Or, that without America, Racism would have long since subsided…?
The only question remaining is: What kind of fool are you? :)
Oh? What races are there there? Do tell! :)
Plenty.
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.galwayraces.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2014%2F02%2FFosters-Cross-Galway-1.jpg&hash=c7a5f04cba3cf76b328a4a690f18f5a9" rel="cached" data-hash="c7a5f04cba3cf76b328a4a690f18f5a9" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://www.galwayraces.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Fosters-Cross-Galway-1.jpg)
Ireland was fairly late in the switch from emigration to immigration, though in these days of increased wealth and easy travel, migration is everywhere. The people on this planet are having a ball.
And despite all the turmoil "evidenced" on TVs the world over much of the world is quite pacific…
But how, I ask you, does one "negotiate" with a group that calls for your nation's annihilation?
Isn't that the question this thread meant to ask? (Or should have…)
———————————————————————————
Races?!
Many years ago I witnessed a few young guys driving their cars 'round the Drive-Thru lane of a local fast food establishment. They drove very fast!
It was after midnight, so business wasn't stiffled. But after a half-hour the squealing tires and revving engines had begun to annoy me. (I worked at a shop next door.)
I accosted the "racers" and asked them to quit. I was told, "We're just going 'round in circles. What could happen?"
I muttered, "Not a NASCAR fan, are you?" Much louder, I threatened calling the police…
The "racers" quit for the evening, and lived another day.
Yay!
You certainly are a dancer Oakdale.
A country that is created with a wonderfully principled Constitution and the creators made it clear the system was for whites and nobody else. That was right from the START. Northern States looked down on those south of the Mason-Dixon and tutted on slavery whilst ignoring the hard fact that slave ships docked at northern harbours. That arch hypocrite the wonderful Abarham Lincoln (groan) who's statue I ignored on my two visits to nutjob land gave out the guff about slavery. And what do you know in private conversations he made it clear that voting and staus for blacks was a nono. Right into the 1960's there were still non-whites without a vote, getting violence and how do you explain all the racial history violence right from the start I mention? Principles mean sod all except on paper. Even your army as I reminded had to operate racist rules during WW2 fighting racist Germans. Brilliant! So be as satirical as you feel inclined to because the principles do not match the practice and it is still the same today. Yeah blah about principles, freedoms, rights, constitution but in practice means nothing. The only success in your long racial circus is there are no longer 2 million KKK members running police, city councils, police officers and so on. You are a bit more subtle about the keeping the blacks down nowa.
Right into the 1960's there were still non-whites without a vote, getting violence and how do you explain all the racial history violence right from the start
We learned it from the British…
Of course, not from the Scots! They're only British whan tae ca git som'ting oot it!
I've a great respect for the intellectual prowess of Scotsmen! They've usually left your isle for "greener" pastures! Back when they stayed home, you,
Howie, would have been the square peg…
How -I ask- did you become a Socialist?
As I have pointed out - anything outside of the Rockwell man is socialist so no surprise your country is in a damn internal mess. Creating wars everywhere, police out of control with guns, tens of millions of poor. All self-created so kind of shows great at being politically inept. We have a wider tolerance in our system and indeed representation.
Under Trump, USA moved its embassy to Jerusalem, recognising it as Israel's capital. Under Biden, USA still claims self-defense for Israel, but not for Palestine.
[video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4SxU77Hfr5M[/video]
And as usual, Israel started it. Not for self-defense, not even for pre-emptive self-defense, but because it is opportune for Netanyahu yet again.
The fighting has, for the moment, disrupted efforts by Netanyahu’s political opponents to form a new government coalition, prolonging his effort to stay in office after inconclusive elections. His rivals have three weeks to agree on a coalition but need the support of an Arab party, whose leader has said he cannot negotiate while Israel is fighting in Gaza.
It does come across as a fairly transparent, reckless attempt by Netanyahu to prolong his time in politics. :(
Hamas fired how many rockets into Israel...?
Hamas is a terrorist organization and their rocket attacks should be unconditionally condemned. But this was also calculated political recklessness and opportunism by Netanyahu. His political end is nigh and apparently, cynically, a battle for Jerusalem during Ramadan is just the thing. Close the gate, close the Al-Aksa mosque without provocation, kick people out of their homes, wait for the Hamas deplorables to take the bait. Mission accomplished, even if presumably slightly more so than expected.
Also keep in mind Hamas has more popular support among Palestinians now because of that wretched wall and because of the increasingly apartheid-based state (https://www.dw.com/en/former-pm-barak-israel-on-slippery-slope-towards-apartheid/a-39356087).
Here's an opinion piece from Israel.
The security mavens want as much war as possible because in their heart of hearts they like wars, those are their strongest memories. A war that is never enough for them, just to hit them, to prove that we’re strong. All the wars in Gaza and Lebanon, which didn’t accomplish anything, didn’t teach them anything either. They stick to their guns. If only we had listened to them at the time, there would have been tens of thousands of dead, and only then would the desired victory have been attained, which will never be attained.
Like fata morgana in the desert, they approach victory, and it distances itself from them. It will never be attained by force. Since we didn’t listen to them, they’re trying again. To strike and smash, a ludicrous caricature from the mouths of those who were once generals, or those who dreamed of being generals and weren’t.
In the pictures in this article you can compare Hamas rockets with Israel's Iron Dome.
Hamas' artillery rockets are basic in design, based on Soviet-era technology...
The situation is this: Israel every once in a while wipes out not only the military arsenal of Palestinians, but also basic tools and means of sustenance. Remember that Palestinians are under complete blockade. Palestinians have only what Israel has permitted them to have. The rockets that reach Israel are allowed through so "self-defence" with helicopters and fighter jets can start. Palestinians do not have any air force or support from outside world, such as from Egypt or Jordan, at all. Israel is not facing an equal army, but cornered inmates of a refugee camp.
Three aging kings of their sand castles. Likud keeps control over Israel, Fatah over the West Bank, Hamas over Gaza. Likud has been a little wobbly, but this little gambit might straighten them up for a while. They all know it is as good as it gets. None of them should be there, none of them have much prospects, or remaining friends. All they have is the fear of losing what they got.
Iraq is in ruins, Syria is in ruins, Lebanon is in ruins. Netanyahu was there. A prosperous Palestine is not in his cards.
Benjamin Netanyahu's not-so-prescient 2002 message to Congress about Iraq (https://www.vox.com/2015/2/26/8114221/netanyahu-iraq-2002)
He is just one malignant force among many, a Milošević of the Middle East continuing the work of Amir, but few have personally so many lost lives on their conscience as Netanyahu. Israel played their part, but the inadequacies of the PLO also helped propel Hamas to power.
Gaza has been a slum for generations, but by location few cities have a better location than they do at the Eastern Mediterranean by the Suez Canal. With the airport bombed by Israel, the coast blockaded, borders walled, ruled by Hamas, businesses chronically interrupted, few cities have worse prospects.
I discovered Travelingisrael some five years ago or so. I appreciate a good professional tour guide. I have passed some of the same training and done plenty of tour guiding informally. Most of what I know about the attitudes and culture in Israel I know from the videos of Travelingisrael.
Anyway, on topic: Travelingisrael is an outright Zionist. He considers his positions "centrist", positions such as that there was no such thing as Palestinian people in the first half of the 20th century, so the land was up for grabs, and of course Jews/Israelis have a historical+moral+divine priority to it over everybody else. Plus Israel has committed no atrocities that would not be overshadowed by atrocities against the Jewish people.
This being a debate forum, feel free to debate.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jsm5AUE0UDs
Travelingisrael hits back against Lonerbox.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5wVaNknEkY
He makes a compelling case about the nature of the attack on the first Arab village by Israel in 1948. However, Nakba is not just about the first village. It is about Israel's policy of expulsion of Arab population. There is no way to deny that that was (and is) the policy.
In 1947/8, borders were assigned for Israel. People either recognise those borders or not. Arabs did not. And also Israel immediately overstepped those borders in every direction, so de facto Israel does not recognise those borders either. Thus Israel by its own measure is no better than Arabs.
For Travelingisrael (and other Zionists) Israel's behaviour is no different from the way other nation states emerged after WWII at the dissolution of European empires. The sad thing is that European empires were colonial, and even after formal dissolution or reform still retain colonial behaviour and colonial instincts to this day. You can choose to do either the right thing or follow the example of Western colonial hypocrites. Looking at Israel's behaviour — Palestinian territories either blockaded or occupied and burdened with Jewish kibbutz-colonies; Golan Heights occupied and the southern portions of Lebanon and Syria under periodic terror attacks because of it; policy of expulsion of original population in constant swing since 1948 — Israel has consistently refrained from doing the right thing.