Well, let me introduce you to the thread about The Past of and The Consequencies for the so-call "Old Word" (right term?) -- i.e. Europa, Asia Minor, North Africa (then - just
Africa), and all the way by the Arabian Peninsula, across the Tigris & Euphrates, through the Iranian plateau - up to India where Alex the Macedonian ceased his incredible advance.
Important: Africa within its ethnic territories, the colonisation era and so such will
(?) be covered separately, as well as the vast space East from Volga, and Tibet and to the East, as well as Australia with Oceania -- they experienced some prehistoric colonisation of sorts apart from the much more modern jailing enterprise. As well as Americas: they also had a much-much pre-historic course of inhabitation, developed cultures of their own long before being conquered by conquistadores & co.
For the starters,
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fcommons%2F7%2F7d%2FMediterr%25C3%25A1neo_a%25C3%25B1o_800_dC_1.gif&hash=96271246cddc6adb45b9634ab64d7f68" rel="cached" data-hash="96271246cddc6adb45b9634ab64d7f68" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7d/Mediterr%C3%A1neo_a%C3%B1o_800_dC_1.gif) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nomenclature_of_Territorial_Units_for_Statistics)
...your map of Europe by 800 Ad is incorrect, Jax. Al-Andaluz is the part that is now located in Spain and had given origin to Andalucia. In Portugal was called Al-Gharb, therefore being today Algarve. :)
Let's rock! :headbang:
Seems like I may of read a book about this once.
The "Old World" resumes to Romans, Muslims and Catholicism.
All the rest is folklore and mercantilism. And pollution, smog and tuberculosis from industrial "revolution".
Not to speak about masses doing tourism, watch television and behave gayist. Poor old world women with such "males".
Well, let me introduce you to the thread about The Past of and The Consequencies for the so-call "Old Word" (right term?) -- i.e. Europa, Asia Minor, North Africa (then - just Africa), and all the way by the Arabian Peninsula, across the Tigris & Euphrates, through the Iranian plateau - up to India where Alex the Macedonian ceased his incredible advance.
Important: Africa within its ethnic territories, the colonisation era and so such will(?) be covered separately, as well as the vast space East from Volga, and Tibet and to the East, as well as Australia with Oceania -- they experienced some prehistoric colonisation of sorts apart from the much more modern jailing enterprise. As well as Americas: they also had a much-much pre-historic course of inhabitation, developed cultures of their own long before being conquered by conquistadores & co.
For the starters,
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fcommons%2F7%2F7d%2FMediterr%25C3%25A1neo_a%25C3%25B1o_800_dC_1.gif&hash=96271246cddc6adb45b9634ab64d7f68" rel="cached" data-hash="96271246cddc6adb45b9634ab64d7f68" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7d/Mediterr%C3%A1neo_a%C3%B1o_800_dC_1.gif) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nomenclature_of_Territorial_Units_for_Statistics)
...your map of Europe by 800 Ad is incorrect, Jax. Al-Andaluz is the part that is now located in Spain and had given origin to Andalucia. In Portugal was called Al-Gharb, therefore being today Algarve. :)
Let's rock! :headbang:
It's actually supposed to be, "For starters," . :)
#GrammarNazi'd
Thank you! I really try to get it, but as I only met this one here on DnD (or a bit earlier on MyOpera but not likely) and its use is not regular... Thank you.
Cheers. :cheers:
The Old World? I'll give you the Old World. (The description you gave was not the old world, but the West.)
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.washingtonpost.com%2Fblogs%2Fworldviews%2Ffiles%2F2014%2F01%2F26271801-1.jpg&hash=80b7b321717018a4401b54b69fc7ad5a" rel="cached" data-hash="80b7b321717018a4401b54b69fc7ad5a" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/files/2014/01/26271801-1.jpg) (http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/files/2014/01/26271801-1.jpg)
Chmuck you, Jax! Good morning!..
And to you too (though it must be afternoon over there).
Something a little more modern:
[video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXiLMb-OFgY[/video]
It's not exactly World history. I was gonna say "it's on topic", but it rather looks like a "cherry-picking history".
You said "old world". 5000 years ago is reasonably old.
Conjectured (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neolithic_Revolution) spread of agriculture (with the DNA history of domesticated animals and plants a much better picture could be made, but this should do for now):
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fcommons%2Fthumb%2Fe%2Fe9%2FCentres_of_origin_and_spread_of_agriculture.svg%2F1280px-Centres_of_origin_and_spread_of_agriculture.svg.png&hash=b74a7c8f8512d238a73471f723b56735" rel="cached" data-hash="b74a7c8f8512d238a73471f723b56735" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e9/Centres_of_origin_and_spread_of_agriculture.svg/1280px-Centres_of_origin_and_spread_of_agriculture.svg.png) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e9/Centres_of_origin_and_spread_of_agriculture.svg/1280px-Centres_of_origin_and_spread_of_agriculture.svg.png)
You said "old world"...
Wrong!
The 'Old World''s History (https://dndsanctuary.eu/index.php?topic=305.msg17472#msg17472)
5000 years ago is reasonably old.
You damn' Chinese! Don't you really know what the thread is about! ?
There are so-called
anthropomorphisms.
5000 years ago is reasonably old.
Conjectured (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neolithic_Revolution) spread of agriculture (with the DNA history of domesticated animals and plants a much better picture could be made, but this should do for now):
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fcommons%2Fthumb%2Fe%2Fe9%2FCentres_of_origin_and_spread_of_agriculture.svg%2F1280px-Centres_of_origin_and_spread_of_agriculture.svg.png&hash=b74a7c8f8512d238a73471f723b56735" rel="cached" data-hash="b74a7c8f8512d238a73471f723b56735" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e9/Centres_of_origin_and_spread_of_agriculture.svg/1280px-Centres_of_origin_and_spread_of_agriculture.svg.png) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e9/Centres_of_origin_and_spread_of_agriculture.svg/1280px-Centres_of_origin_and_spread_of_agriculture.svg.png)
It is total bullshit in terms of anything.
Human acted long before 5ka(:lol:), but it's not our topic anyway.
It is total bullshit in terms of anything.
Human acted long before 5ka( :lol: ), but it's not our topic anyway.
And people had telephones long before a 140ish years ago? :P
???
up to India where Alex the Macedonian ceased his incredible advance.
It was large for its time, and very large given the starting point, but it wasn't that large compared to other empires to come, basically the size of the Persian empire, and short-lived. Even so the consequences of this disruptive change shouldn't be underestimated.
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fspchumanities.files.wordpress.com%2F2012%2F11%2Fmap_05-02.jpg&hash=cbd93d6db8e319a12996a3cd8cb0a6be" rel="cached" data-hash="cbd93d6db8e319a12996a3cd8cb0a6be" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://spchumanities.files.wordpress.com/2012/11/map_05-02.jpg)
Here's a highly Iranocentric timeline of empires that included Persian/Iranian territory.
[video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c4ORmtZ2Go4[/video]
And people had telephones long before a 140ish years ago? :P
If not phones, at least Phoenicians.
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fmapcollection.files.wordpress.com%2F2012%2F06%2Fgreek-phoenician-colonies.jpg&hash=868d01d4e91d2467fc386274dee3da28" rel="cached" data-hash="868d01d4e91d2467fc386274dee3da28" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://mapcollection.files.wordpress.com/2012/06/greek-phoenician-colonies.jpg)
If not phones, at least Phoenicians.
And if not Phoenicians, at least phonologists.
If not phones, at least Phoenicians.
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fmapcollection.files.wordpress.com%2F2012%2F06%2Fgreek-phoenician-colonies.jpg&hash=868d01d4e91d2467fc386274dee3da28" rel="cached" data-hash="868d01d4e91d2467fc386274dee3da28" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://mapcollection.files.wordpress.com/2012/06/greek-phoenician-colonies.jpg)
They obviously were some
sea people, :right:?
This is an Egyptian picture of Sea People (http://www.salimbeti.com/micenei/sea.htm).
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.salimbeti.com%2Fmicenei%2Fimages%2Fseapeoples62.jpg&hash=d143adb64bd222293ba0ee933f9e983d" rel="cached" data-hash="d143adb64bd222293ba0ee933f9e983d" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://www.salimbeti.com/micenei/images/seapeoples62.jpg)
They're not Phoenician. :D
Nah, I've read that the Sea People were some special guys and had probably been unaccounted for - as to who they were exactly etc. I just referred to the map (http://mapcollection.files.wordpress.com/2012/06/greek-phoenician-colonies.jpg) - will you take a look at it (http://mapcollection.files.wordpress.com/2012/06/greek-phoenician-colonies.jpg) once more?:)
That map is a little misleading as they likely had a series of colonies, rather than a continuous landmass. This map from the China thread is better.
Old-style colonies (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colonies_in_antiquity) are not around that much anymore.
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fcommons%2Fthumb%2Ff%2Ff4%2FAntikeGriechen1.jpg%2F1280px-AntikeGriechen1.jpg&hash=fffbd1df150d4f41c83bdea1c210ff82" rel="cached" data-hash="fffbd1df150d4f41c83bdea1c210ff82" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f4/AntikeGriechen1.jpg/1280px-AntikeGriechen1.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f4/AntikeGriechen1.jpg/1280px-AntikeGriechen1.jpg)
By the way, the current-day Maltese seem to be around 30% of Phoenician stock (DNA).
Do you use the German Wiki????
That map is a little misleading as they likely had a series of colonies, rather than a continuous landmass. This map from the China thread is better.
Old-style colonies (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colonies_in_antiquity) are not around that much anymore.
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fcommons%2Fthumb%2Ff%2Ff4%2FAntikeGriechen1.jpg%2F1280px-AntikeGriechen1.jpg&hash=fffbd1df150d4f41c83bdea1c210ff82" rel="cached" data-hash="fffbd1df150d4f41c83bdea1c210ff82" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f4/AntikeGriechen1.jpg/1280px-AntikeGriechen1.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f4/AntikeGriechen1.jpg/1280px-AntikeGriechen1.jpg)
By the way, the current-day Maltese seem to be of significant Phoenician stock (by DNA, a load of caveats apply).
What are the colours?
Yellow seems to be about Poenicians, :right:? While the third (grey) seems to me reading "Google":lol:
Yes. But this picture is also used on English Wikipedia.
I'm a fool! The grey must be "Germans"!:)
Red is Greek colonies (which this map really is about), yellow is Phoenician colonies and cities and gray is other cities. I don't think it is fully complete on the Phoenicians, and definitely not on others, but the map is pleasing (here in full size (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f4/AntikeGriechen1.jpg)).
One of the gray cities, Rome, is soon going to have a significant role, or so I am told.
One of the gray cities, Rome, is soon going to have a significant role, or so I am told.
How come?
:hehe:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f4/AntikeGriechen1.jpg
Where the Phoenicians came from?
Were they Africans or... Atlantisians?:hehe: :)
Where the Phoenicians came from?
Were they Africans or... Atlantisians?:hehe: :)
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fkadmous.org%2Fwp%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2Feurope-phoenician-princess1-1024x768.jpg&hash=a38137161353217b80dd1c13b0ba08fe" rel="cached" data-hash="a38137161353217b80dd1c13b0ba08fe" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://kadmous.org/wp/wp-content/uploads/europe-phoenician-princess1-1024x768.jpg)
From cities in what today is Lebanon. Europa (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europa_(mythology)) was a Phoenician princess abducted to Crete, according to Greek myth. The Greek alphabet comes from the Phoenician alphabet (the name Bible comes from the Phoenician city Byblos).
Were they sorta prehistoric Jews?:)
Were they sorta prehistoric Jews? :)
The Jews were living further south. Also note that since we know a lot about the Phoenician alphabet (https://dndsanctuary.eu/index.php?topic=104.msg15416#msg15416), that would imply they're not a part of prehistory — at least by the time the map is about.
If they were history, then what about their predecessors in the region? I know there was Egypt. But as well as I learned, they didn't travel far. And they're sorta on the edge of our territory - at least culturally - ???
And let's not forget about the other "end" -- India. Long ago - before those major ethnicity - the land was occupied by a different people -- who left both cultural heritage and elements of the further cultural basics. Right?
Who's an expert? I read Wiki. Not recently...
At the time, Britain was inhabited primarily by squirrels. :D
At the time, Britain was inhabited primarily by squirrels. :D
Some squirrels. :right:
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fcommons%2Fthumb%2F3%2F3c%2FStonehenge2007_07_30.jpg%2F800px-Stonehenge2007_07_30.jpg&hash=53c9a55f16db37fa79cbefa6ad29d275" rel="cached" data-hash="53c9a55f16db37fa79cbefa6ad29d275" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/3c/Stonehenge2007_07_30.jpg/800px-Stonehenge2007_07_30.jpg) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Stonehenge2007_07_30.jpg)
And going even further back in time, twice as far back as the above map of the Mediterranean:
(https://dndsanctuary.eu/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2F1.bp.blogspot.com%2F-KpFbOjsuMyk%2FT_AkS96AZxI%2FAAAAAAAACHY%2F3O21YFso2xE%2Fs1600%2FSkara_Brae_kap_KB_03.jpg&hash=39c462e2c9a0b6202dbb68b016388062" rel="cached" data-hash="39c462e2c9a0b6202dbb68b016388062" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-KpFbOjsuMyk/T_AkS96AZxI/AAAAAAAACHY/3O21YFso2xE/s1600/Skara_Brae_kap_KB_03.jpg) (http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-KpFbOjsuMyk/T_AkS96AZxI/AAAAAAAACHY/3O21YFso2xE/s1600/Skara_Brae_kap_KB_03.jpg)
Another time sequence, a little bit more recent.
[video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1e_AZ3j2LbY[/video]
The odd thing about how things look in that animation is how some of the periods without any activity probably represent the worst battles of the war.