Skip to main content ↑ ↓

Poll

Should Scotland be an independent country?

Yes.
[ 8 ] (57.1%)
No.
[ 6 ] (42.9%)

Total Members Voted: 12

Topic: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time (Read 98028 times)

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #125 –
Saw this in FB today, and figured Mr. Howie would like it:

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #126 –
He does, he does. And he is going to a rally in September in Edinburgh with an organisation to outdo the nationalist parade last year.
"Quit you like men:be strong"

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #128 –
An interesting article certainly touching on some reality. That many Scots want separation is a disappointment but there agin sentimentality has always been part of the psyche. Granny's Hielan' Hame and some warped dream with the bagpipes (not my favourite instrument by the way). Even intelligent people thinking separation will be wonderful. Salmond's brain dead propaganda is all about emotion. What does he not understand about the Chancellor George Osborne's statement on the pound? The 3 main Westminster parties are all agreed that an independent Scotland would have it's own currency no the British one. The UK pound stops being a Scots currency on departing. However Salmond has no Plan B on the currency hence his blustering about "we would still have the British pound." Cobblers.

An example of the Nationalist odd ideology amongst the intelligent is this inclident. One of the regular staff a woman in her late 30's got a degree at university and in a face-t-face discussion she came out with the Salmond guff that "Scotland would get a Tory government if we didn't vote for Salmond." I pointed out to her as i said in an earlier submission here that since the 2nd World War, Scotland voted twice for the Conservatives and there was a UK Tory government and on 8 times voted Labour and the national government was Labour. She was simply being a parrot to what Salmond blusters. When I pointed this out she didn't have an answer.

One of the negatives in the debate are the people who say they don't know enough and need to know more before the decide. Talk about being daft when we get the policies of both No and Yes on television, newspapers and through the door! It is easier for the Nats to bellow on because they have a single aim but I still think they will lose as most Scots would prefer more powers inside Gt Britain not jumping into the dark. Salmond used to court RC's and pally with their Cardinal until he got caught with poofing attempts. He says nothing now as the Pope is a NO man (!) as is Obama and that Clinton woman.

I might be annoyed at the level of Scots who say yes but that will I foretell slip onthe voting day. Salmond once got put out of the SNP for being so far letist they couldn't take it - and a staunch Republican. Now he is a "convinced" monarchist but he knows that there is a chunk of his party who are not so inclined and they are keeping mouths shut rather than lose votes. Some have been whispering about a further referendum on the monarchy on a separation. Salmond and that woman Sturgeon are bruisers and blusterers. They cannot tell us how much separating  the functions of the State would cost but would borrow hundreds of millions to aid it! They tell us Scotland would have a unique place in the world appealing to the sentimental again. People seeing my No sticker on a jacket have asked for some - actually it uses the Scots word "Naw" and happy yo pas them on. The SNP leaders have already said that Scots who don't support them are doing Scotland down and in fact vistrtually telling the majority of Scots Unionists some kind of quislings. I have no time for such nonsense.

Most people I think don't get too worked up on local or national election voting and I suspect they are a bit fed up with the daily dosage on the media. For me I just want to get the damn thing over with and vote in the September Referendum then fly off to the Netherlandsjust after to celebrate the "NO" vote!

Proud to be Scots - proud to be British..bring it on.
"Quit you like men:be strong"

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #129 –
Quote from: rjhowie on
Proud to be Scots - proud to be British..bring it on.

But I'd usually rather be somewhere else…? :)

I greatly enjoyed this post of yours, rj! (This, from someone who calls US politics daft!)
进行 ...
"Humor is emotional chaos remembered in tranquility." - James Thurber
"Science is the belief in the ignorance of experts!" - Richard Feynman
 (iBook G4 - Panther | Mac mini i5 - El Capitan)

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #130 –
RJH - has there been any clarification in Scotland about how things might work if a separated Scotland would use the Pound, while not being part of a currency union?

On the detailed, but practical and important, issue of physical bank notes, I have to admit to you that I refused a Scottish note in my change the other day. It was given in an automatic check out machine at a hardware store. I saw the manager and got "real money" back. Now I know, as do most, that Scottish notes are legal tender but it was only the third or so such note I'd seen in my life and I didn't want to get stuck with it.

I can imagine that non-problem becoming a real one in the "keeping the pound regardless" scenario. For border trade, for example, and for visits. Where will Scotland get it's actual money from? I can imagine a situation like it was in Russia on the early in the `90s when visitors would be asked for dollars (for a discount) as it was a stable currency.

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #131 –
A Nation that doesn't take its destiny in its own hands, it's not a Nation.
Nothing can change this.
A matter of attitude.

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #132 –
Quote from: Belfrager on

A Nation that doesn't take its destiny in its own hands, it's not a Nation.
Nothing can change this.
Does that mean, in your view, that none of the countries in the EU are true nations?

What about members of the UN?

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #133 –
Quote from: string on
Does that mean, in your view, that none of the countries in the EU are true nations?

Not anymore since the initial EU project as a Union based in independent and mutually respecting Nations (never federalism)  turned into one more German attempt of domination of Europe.
No wonder nationalisms to be emerging all over the place - We are real Nations, we don't submit to others.

You, the British, do well with your half in half out strategy.
Rjhowie's posts have been an endless crying for your protection. I don't like to see Scotland and the brave Scots reduced to that.
Quote from: string on
What about members of the UN?

UN can't hardly be taken as anything serious. That's only folklore and a good job for those there.
A matter of attitude.

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #134 –
Quote from: Belfrager on
...
1   You, the British, do well with your half in half out strategy.
2   Rjhowie's posts have been an endless crying for your protection. I don't like to see Scotland and the brave Scots reduced to that.


On 1 -- I agree with that actually

On 2 --  That I don't agree with - I need protection from rjh not the other way round. ;)

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #135 –
On where Scotland will get real money after the split: Possibly from the same place the United States gets it. A printing press, and your full faith and trust in-- in this case-- the government of Scotland.

I find out that the US dollar is backed by--- nothing. Your faith that the dollar is any good for anything is about it. Of late, a lot of world currencies seem to be backed by diddly. Once upon a time, printed money was backed by gold, and a dollar could purchase a dollar's worth of gold and was "as good as gold". Today-- not so much. We've been on your faith and trust in the US government since Nixon took us off of the gold standard in 1972.
What would happen if a large asteroid slammed into the Earth?
According to several tests involving a watermelon and a large hammer, it would be really bad!

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #136 –
The problem is, though, that Scotland cannot print Pound notes after separation. At the moment they print them but that is only because they are agreed to be legal tender by the UK central government. Were they to go on printing them without a currency union, then they would become, in effect, forgeries and not be currency which could be exchanged with Sterling notes.

Consequently they would be a Scottish currency, with their own value, different from the pound.

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #137 –
Quote from: mjmsprt40 on
I find out that the US dollar is backed by--- nothing.

Wrong. It's backed by the biggest army in the world. That's why the USA needs desperately to have such absurd.

Saddam Hussein announced that he would sell his petrol in other currencies than dollar. See what happened to him.
Qaddafi went further, he said he would sell his petrol in anything but dollar. See what happened to him.

Technically it's a forgery, a fake currency. If a true currency, you'll have an inflation of 1000% monthly due to the amount of currency you just print. It doesn't happens that way by the solely reason that your army keeps "convincing" the world to accept it.

It wont last longer. Specially when Chinese already have more dollars than you do. The moment they want and it's the collapse. 
Ironically it would also produce a Chinese collapse, so that's the reason why dollar (and the USA) keeps existing.

The world is turning a dangerous place.
A matter of attitude.

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #138 –
It is possible to have a currency union, but it is not worth the pain, uncertainty, and suffering. When Czechoslovakia split, that's what happened, a transitional de facto currency union, and then the Czechoslovak koruna (Crown) became the Czech koruna and Slovak koruna. Until Slovakia joined another currency union that is, the Eurozone.

It went pretty smoothly. Great for collectors.

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #139 –
On the matter of sharing the Pound with a separated Scotland (a currency Union), the position of the UK Government is based on two primary aspects.

1. the report given by the Chief Secretary to the Treasury: Scotland analysis: assessment of a sterling currency union

2.  The unpopularity of such a Currency Union with the Public, which results in a political imperative to avoid  such a notion.

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #140 –
I'm curious as to whether or not @Luxor will provide us any updates on the "Yes" campaign?

Internet links are great, but I also like to hear from people on the ground. Mr. Howie has thoroughly covered the "Better Together" campaign.

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #141 –
Quote from: Colonel Rebel on
Mr. Howie has thoroughly covered the "Better Together" campaign.

If Dobbin's "blinders" constitute a viewpoint… :)
进行 ...
"Humor is emotional chaos remembered in tranquility." - James Thurber
"Science is the belief in the ignorance of experts!" - Richard Feynman
 (iBook G4 - Panther | Mac mini i5 - El Capitan)

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #142 –
Firstly Oakdale your assessment of my thoughts on the American system are straight to the point anhd we can all see it asd , well factual. For all your huffing and puffing if a State wanted to vote on leaving the Union all hell would break lose so no advice from your corner is valid.

As for curr3ncy in an independent Scotland , I have already said here that the SNP cannot answer the question properly. They say it is their pound too but that is plain stupid asd it stops being yours if you leave. The GB government and in fact the 3 main GB parties have all said there would be NO currency union and when Salmond is asked about a plan B he cannot answer it. Instead he just blusters and boasts that the currency will be the same.! How can you be independent and still want your currency linked to the Bank of England? And how stupid is that idea in an independent country. It would mean that no matter what was decided in Edinburgh the Bank of England would still control your money! The emotional nonsense that an independent Scotland would have a special place in the world is another nationalist mythology that the brain dead emotionals will grit their teeth on but is a load of nonsense.  On defence we would have an atmed service of some 15,000 including an army, "air force" and "navy" which would include frigates. Ha, ha, it gets better all the time.  They choose to ignore that fact that Scots serving in HM Forces of the UK don't want to be in a "Scottish Defence Force." To separate finance, taxation, pensions and all the other State things the SNP says would cost 250 million - just another vague sum plucked out of the sky.

The other day an assistant in my local convenience store asked for some of my No jacket stickers and was getting into a young man (early 20's) she knew and directed me to slaughter him politically which I did. He then whimpered that we would still have The Queen and I laughed at his ignorance. I pointed out to him that there was a considerable republican bent amongst SNP people and they didn't want to contradict Salmond in public. However a couple have broke ranks and said that in a separate Scotland they would want a referendum on the Monarchy. However, i do hope they keep that slant up as it will lose them more votes.  Nice of you by the way Colonel to want a "balance" from our nationalist pal but I have had a good meal.
On a lighter note. Thanks for your contribution dear Belfrager on nationhood but you are not in a country to boast about on that one! And I am still arranging a NO celebration holiday to Holland right after the Referendum as well as a success party.  The Union Flag will continue to fly at the front of my home as well. Indeed a single lady who owns the house 3 along took me for a nice drive and meal in a posh restaurant down the coast on seeing my flag up.
"Quit you like men:be strong"

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #143 –
Quote from: rjhowie on
Thanks for your contribution dear Belfrager on nationhood

You're welcome, I always like to help those who needs.
Quote from: rjhowie on
but you are not in a country to boast about on that one!

Really? :)
You're funny.

I understand your nervousness but don't worry. You can always ask for asylum at my beautiful sunny Country after your defeat at the referendum. I foresee a difficult life for collaborationists up there.
A matter of attitude.

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #144 –
The money issue is no small thing.

Consider that if the United States were still on the Pound, the Bank of England could yank our chain whenever they wanted to. And that, with three thousand miles of Atlantic Ocean separating us from them.

Now consider that Scotland is on the same island with England and Wales, and-- well, you get the picture. If you want real independence, you have to get your own money. Otherwise you're like a grown child that moves from your parent's home, but you still expect your parents to pay your rent, feed you, pay your car payments and so on. You might be "free"-- but you're not really free until you're fully responsible for your own upkeep. Until then-- the parents can set the rules because if you don't like what they say, they can just stop paying for everything-- and then what will you do?

If Scotland wants real independence, they have to start thinking about how they're gonna pay for it without depending on England's money.
What would happen if a large asteroid slammed into the Earth?
According to several tests involving a watermelon and a large hammer, it would be really bad!

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #146 –
Me to the left of where string??

Oh and to the Lisbon man, I think Scotland is in a far better sttae that sunny Portugal. It maybe nice to enjoy the weather but considering the place is in financial meltdown, unemployment sky high small wonder Portugese can spend so much time sunning. No comparison dear chap. Oh and Gt Britain is seeing the fasts economic growth in Europe while you had to fall back on handouts....

So do feel free to be with us and under what you like....a monarch.......

Meanwhile roll on September when i will take th train to Edinburgh for a Unionist parade by the OO which will be (like the last one) bigger than that poor thing the Nationalists waffled through the streets with. Now it's Friday so must get out to get more "NO" jacket stickers and re-arrange my flag further out the upstairs window.
"Quit you like men:be strong"

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #147 –
Quote from: SmileyFaze on


Well, up front I don't have a dog in that hunt.

That said, when I was last in the general vicinity of the British Isles, 2 of the people I spoke to at length -- who do have -- who do have a vested interest in the outcome -- they both independently said it wouldn't even be close. One said it would be 60% for, & the other indicated upwards of 70% for......................


Just for everyone's information, well anyone who remembers a post I made a while back where I posted on how 2 close friends near the action in Scotland saw this Independence thing going down, well since that time it looks like RJ is goin' to stumble into a jig.

My friends are now saying that since we last spoke, there has been a turnabout -- the tides seems to have changed, & have switched to go the other way by over 55% against Independence & Liberty, so RJ & his Royal Bum Sniffer lot will probably be getting their noses filled to the eyeballs with English excremental delight.

I wonder if they do have their way, will the loyal Scots feel the wrath of the English hermaphrodites in Westminster, & be personally saddled with all the ￡36 million or so it costs to keep their toilets sparkling, & the Charlie's boy-toy affairs with Jimmy silent?





Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #148 –
Well, SF, the 70% figure was always a figure brewed in Guiness with a chaser of Scotch. There has been no switch as described by you. That was just bar room fantasizing.

As for the usual diatribe of hate - a colourful display of Ersatz Irish Republican BS - nothing else.

Re: The Great DnD Vote of Our Time

Reply #149 –
Do you remember George Galloway? He was the one who confronted some American committee or other. Whatever side of the issue of the time you were on, you must have enjoyed the little guy giving it to a row of stuffed shirts!.

Anyway in the link below you will see a report on a speech he gave on the Scottish Referendum. Part way down that page you will find an audio of the speech; I suggest you listen to that, rather than read the article,  to get the full impact of what he had to say. It's for a British audience of course, but others might find it interesting.

Scottish independence: Listen to George Galloway’s stirring speech in defence of the Union