Where debating everything under the sun is only the beginning

As for all the rest, I have to remember you midnight that you are just a small wheel of the mechanism I've denounced.

Oh please. You've jumped the shark by bringing in the old tin-foil hat "gay agenda" conspiracy theory. The 911 conspiracy theories pretty much make more sense than this.

You've jumped the shark by bringing in the old tin-foil hat "gay agenda" conspiracy theory.

Sorry, but you lost all credibility after you failed to deal with the fact that gay agenda is not a theory where we live.

It's not a real theory. It's a tinfoil hate conspiracy theory not much better than the "theory" that aliens built Stonehenge or the Pyramids and the government is covering it up.

It's quite sad how you have replaced rational argument with mere insults.

Gay agenda is live and well all over the world.

And billions spent with it. Who pays and in exchange for what?

I'll be surprised to find European constitutions not having similar provisions.

As I said, LGBT lobby (or gay agenda) may differ from place to place.

The Gay Lizard alliance

Quote from: midnight raccoon on 2016-06-21, 06:15:05

I'll be surprised to find European constitutions not having similar provisions.

That would be one of the defining principles of a rechtsstaat.

It's just that it's unfashionable right now to have homosexuality criminalised. I'd say that it's unbecoming of a rechtsstaat to make laws that only appeal to a fashion.

There's no contradiction between having homosexuality criminalised and being a rechtsstaat at the same time.

Valery Zorkin, President of the Constitutional Court of Russia, wrote in 2003:

Becoming a legal state has long been our ultimate goal, and we have certainly made serious progress in this direction over the past several years. However, no one can say now that we have reached this destination. Such a legal state simply cannot exist without a lawful and just society. Here, as in no other sphere of our life, the state reflects the level of maturity reached by society.

Notice what he said just before, "...equal protection under the law as guaranteed by the constitution." He thinks the law and constitution provide equal protection (full stop), instead of equal protection where appropriate and punishment where appropriate.

Homosexuality was criminal fairly recently. There's no contradiction between having homosexuality criminalised and being a rechtsstaat at the same time. It's just that it's unfashionable right now to have homosexuality criminalised. I'd say that it's unbecoming of a rechtsstaat to make laws that only appeal to a fashion.

In way does trying to deny a certain group constitutional rights indicate a just society?

What @midnight raccoon said merely means that all shall be treated the same in equal circumstances.

Indeed, which is why a rechtsstaat shouldn't legislate against the scapegoated minority du jour, like Protestants, Jews, Muslims, witches or homosexuals. Except implicitly of course, insofar as such minority groups hold principles, like wishing to interfere with due process of law, that are incompatible with the rechtsstaat itself.

He displays no understanding that among "all other factors" there could be something like a criminal record

They have no way of separating from this mess fictive marriage, incest, pedophiles, polyamory, etc. Frankly, I have not seen any attempt to separate those, so this is a given.

He displays no understanding that among "all other factors" there could be something like a criminal record which would reduce the citizen's liberties or a severe handicap which would call for special arrangements in order for the citizen to benefit from any said liberty.

Section 1.

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside. No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

Section 2.

Representatives shall be apportioned among the several states according to their respective numbers, counting the whole number of persons in each state, excluding Indians not taxed. But when the right to vote at any election for the choice of electors for President and Vice President of the United States, Representatives in Congress, the executive and judicial officers of a state, or the members of the legislature thereof, is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such state, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States, or in any way abridged, except for participation in rebellion, or other crime, the basis of representation therein shall be reduced in the proportion which the number of such male citizens shall bear to the whole number of male citizens twenty-one years of age in such state.

Section 3.

No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any state, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any state legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any state, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.

Section 4.

The validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law, including debts incurred for payment of pensions and bounties for services in suppressing insurrection or rebellion, shall not be questioned. But neither the United States nor any state shall assume or pay any debt or obligation incurred in aid of insurrection or rebellion against the United States, or any claim for the loss or emancipation of any slave; but all such debts, obligations and claims shall be held illegal and void.

Section 5.

The Congress shall have power to enforce, by appropriate legislation, the provisions of this article

You can't be serious. The data strongly suggested people are born gay, just as they are born into a race/ethnicity. This is unlike criminals who choose to commit their crimes and thus become incarcerated.

If we know that certain brain characteristics may predispose some people to violence, what can we do about it? Intervene — and the earlier, the better, says Raine, author of "The Anatomy of Violence" (Random House, 2013).

 In one intervention, for example, he and colleagues found that 3-year-olds who had been assigned to an enrichment program focused on nutrition, exercise and cognitive skills had better brain functioning at age 11 and a 34 percent reduction in criminal activity at age 23 when compared with a control group that did not receive the intervention (American Journal of Psychiatry, 2003). Intervening even earlier, David Olds, PhD, of the University of Colorado, has found that pregnant low-income mothers who were visited regularly by home nurses who talked to them about health, education and parenting were less likely to have children who were arrested by age 15 (Infant Mental Health Journal, 2006).

Even simple interventions may make a difference. In one preliminary study, prisoners assigned to a 10-week yoga class improved their impulse control (Journal of Psychiatric Research, 2013). In an earlier randomized-controlled trial of British prisoners, those who received vitamin, mineral and essential fatty acid supplements committed an average of 26.3 percent fewer offenses than those who had received the placebo. They also showed a reduction in offenses of more than 35 percent, while the placebo-taking prisoners' records remained stable (British Journal of Psychiatry, 2002). A study in the Netherlands replicated the effect, and now Raine is testing a similar intervention for children.