What has undoubtedly gone over your head, is that you have in a backhanded manner, agreed with my original point.
Which original point? This one? ...
No. My original point. I'm not helping you out here.
I pointed out what I was responding to. You chose not to. So be it.
When I mentioned my original point, what I was referring to was my original point. Not some random point mid way through the conversation. The original one. I assumed that when I stated 'my original' point, you'd understand that that to mean the original point I made. This is a conversation. Usually, the original point will be the first point a person makes.
I didn't think this would be difficult. My bad.
Just to clarify, I was referring to my original point. Not any random points I made since then.
Sweden is a great example. I agree. If you can quietly ignore the half dozen or so wars that they've gotten themselves involved in over the last 300 years.
This is how Swedes define their peace. You are of course welcome to your own opinion on what peace is, but it will be unengaging as long as you don't spell it out yet you assume everybody should accept your silent premises.
Jesus. I'm having to prove that warfare, genocide, ethnic cleansing and violence is a common occurrence across the planet and across all eras, completely regardless of the dominant religion, level of education, economic development and skin colour?
I have to convince you that those lucky countries who have isolated periods of calm are the exception, not the rule? You, sir, are a tough audience!
I suspect the vast majority of people a thousand years ago has a crystal clear sense of purpose. As you say. Something along the lines of 'try not to die today'. Rich people joined in. 'Try not to die this week'.
This was the element I have been objecting to. It was a mere undertext at first but soon enough you spelled it out properly. The way I see it, you have actually conceded my point now when you say:
what I think you'll find is that with a decent education, you'll normally find a population making more intelligent decisions leading to increased prosperity, technological developments etc etc. That there are decent schools tends to be the forerunner of all of this...
Except that you talk without examples, i.e. without data, so it's hard to say. Well, doesn't matter as long as you remain unspecific.
WTF??
1. I have no idea what you're talking about.
2. You had a point? Seriously?
3. Planes, trains and auto-mo-fo-biles. Where's your data?!
Education and social cohesion (you can pick other terms too if you wanted) are two of the foundations of society. How do you measure them? Growing middle classes, wealth, technological development etc etc.
As I thought. We measure those things very differently. I measure education by the quality of books people write. The comparative number of schools and students in successive eras is also a good measure, and evaluations as to what extent rulers support those institutions.
Social cohesion is measured by lack of internal strife, stability of social and administrative institutions, continuity of traditions. Things like that. Something called middle class is applicable only to this century and previous. It's a rather anacronistic and dubious concept to all earlier times.
There have been times and places. A current immediate example is Sweden - 300 years of peace. This is not unprecedented, depends on how you delimit it. If you desperately refuse to see peace among people and prosperity of arts and sciences in old times, you won't see it.
We measure them differently? So, a society is educated providing it has good schools and a few decent books get written. Nevermind if no one acts of any of the lessons learned and the population continues living in piss poor poverty living hand to mouth. Okay dokey.
Alternatively, what I think you'll find is that with a decent education, you'll normally find a population making more intelligent decisions leading to increased prosperity, technological developments etc etc. That there are decent schools tends to be the forerunner of all of this...
Sweden is a great example. I agree. If you can quietly ignore the half dozen or so wars that they've gotten themselves involved in over the last 300 years. I'll award you ten bonus points if you can name the single civilisation in human history that did not arm itself and use those arms.
I'm going to Battle soon. Sustained peace for getting on a thousand years, since the last battle...
What has undoubtedly gone over your head, is that you have in a backhanded manner, agreed with my original point.
Nevermind. Jimbro was right. I should shuffle off to investigate this rumour about him and slaves...
Speaking of "Life", the Life Expectancy of people has increased a lot over the centuries. It must have taken an awful lot of religion to achieve that!
I see, elder people were unknown before the miracle of the industrial revolution and life expectancy has certainly exploded with the advent of atheism...
You might well be on to something!!! A quick look at a few graphs and charts show that both atheism and life expectancy rates started a steep climb from 1950 onwards!
Some people might suggest that things like 'WW2' might be a factor. But let's not worry about inconvenient factors, and celebrate, promote and worship your discovery instead! Hallelujah! Or whatever atheists say....
And whether other little bits of data on development, growth of the middle class and life expectancy support your view is also a little suspect.
"Development", "middle class" and "life expectancy" - the trilogy of political correct materialism. Traduced as consumerism, herds and fear of death. Whatever, I enjoy "suspect" views.
Gary also mentioned economic and technological advances, thus making it even clearer that his measure of development only consists of materialist values. Education, sustained peace and social cohesion failed to enter the picture. Thousand years ago people were more open-minded than they are now, and more structured, with a clear sense of purpose in their lives at the same time. This is an important measure for me at least.
Not true. Education and social cohesion (you can pick other terms too if you wanted) are two of the foundations of society. How do you measure them? Growing middle classes, wealth, technological development etc etc.
Sustained peace? When did that happen? Ever?
People were more open minded a thousand years ago? I guess you could be right How else would Christianity or any other superstition have taken a hold?
A clear sense of purpose? I suspect the vast majority of people a thousand years ago has a crystal clear sense of purpose. As you say. Something along the lines of 'try not to die today'. Rich people joined in. 'Try not to die this week'.
Alternatively, the problem with Islam is that it hasn't had the reformation that helped bring Christianity out of the dark ages.
(And that bit closer to a more sensible secular society)
What took Christianity out of the dark ages was the so called renaissance of the year one thousand. Georges Duby, March Bloch and all other medievalists have demonstrate it for ages. A little bit before the "miracles" of reformation...
Reformation, meaning Lutero, Calvino and their followers, was a political/economical movement supported by the bourgeoisie in order to gain power masked under pretense religious divergence. It still is. It opened the way to the selvage capitalism we assist today that hypocrisy calls liberalism.
Islam can pass very well without it.
That's an interesting alternative take on history. Whether or not historical data on economic and technological advances support your theory is a little bit open to question.
And whether other little bits of data on development, growth of the middle class and life expectancy support your view is also a little suspect.*
(* Of course they do. Such is the joy of inventing and reinventing documented history! A religious speciality that the Catholic church excelled at. Still do, I hear...)
No problem at all with Islam, a so peaceful religion as any other.
Is has some advantages over Christianism, mainly at cohesion social aspects and charity. Besides, are the only ones to really understand what luxury is about.
It has however the same problems of Protestantism, literal interpretations of sacred books mixed with absence of centralized, hierarchical organization and authority leading to that anyone can appear speaking and acting in the "name of Allah".
Alternatively, the problem with Islam is that it hasn't had the reformation that helped bring Christianity out of the dark ages.
(And that bit closer to a more sensible secular society)
The MyOpera blogs racked up high pageranks with Google which made them attractive to link spammers. I sold out. But in the 2 years before being caught by a Mod and given the boot, I raked in about US $20,000 whoring my blog and selling links to people selling 'Rolex' watches, vaginal rejuvenation surgery and other ethically dubious enterprises. So....it was kinda worth it.
Heh, so all is good then. Old name back, clean slate, new site, new chances to sell out...
So, how is the project adding blogs to this web site going?
I shouldn't think that this sort of forum is going to be terribly spam worthy for a while!
Thanks for the welcome back to you all anyway. Good to see you Nick, String and Jim!
I wonder if this is what they meant when they once sent me an e-mail about monetizing small personal blogs.
Possibly. To be fair to the Opera mods, they gave me two warnings in the months before I got the boot. But the money was too good to turn down. I used to use a website called PayPerPost, which was basically a link exchange that got bloggers and advertisers together. In the first couple of years it was awesome. You could do 3 ads per day per blog, and they were paying up to a frankly ridiculous $140 per ad. Most were about $35. But considering you just had to write 100 words per ad, it was freakingly easy cash. It paid for my wedding, my honeymoon, a shiny mountain bike, redecorating my home, a computer, a camera and plenty more.
PayPerPost and its spin offs died a death though. I got out when you were lucky to get a single ad a week for $5. I still run ads on my (non Opera) blogs though. It still pays ok, but nothing like it used too. Anything from £35 to £60 per ad, but ads come along less frequently. I guess I took about £2,000 last year.
Well, all good things must come to an end. But with the end of MyOpera, so my username is reborn....yay!
Whether I will get an awful lot of time to contribute is another matter. But it's nice to know that so many familiar faces have found a corner of the web to congregate.
I guess it's now safe for me to disclose the nature of my Opera banning. In case anyone cares. Which you probably don't. But still. The MyOpera blogs racked up high pageranks with Google which made them attractive to link spammers. I sold out. But in the 2 years before being caught by a Mod and given the boot, I raked in about US $20,000 whoring my blog and selling links to people selling 'Rolex' watches, vaginal rejuvenation surgery and other ethically dubious enterprises. So....it was kinda worth it. Especially considering how far $20k stretched in Mexico.
I'm still rather sad to see the old DandD go under though. Surely adding it onto their new forums wouldn't have been too much expense or hard work.
Good to see ya posting again old buddy; the whole gang is here (even Mr. Howie!).
Good to see y'all too. What about Bantay? GOM? Or did they, eventually, disappear?
Well, all good things must come to an end. But with the end of MyOpera, so my username is reborn....yay!
Whether I will get an awful lot of time to contribute is another matter. But it's nice to know that so many familiar faces have found a corner of the web to congregate.
I guess it's now safe for me to disclose the nature of my Opera banning. In case anyone cares. Which you probably don't. But still. The MyOpera blogs racked up high pageranks with Google which made them attractive to link spammers. I sold out. But in the 2 years before being caught by a Mod and given the boot, I raked in about US $20,000 whoring my blog and selling links to people selling 'Rolex' watches, vaginal rejuvenation surgery and other ethically dubious enterprises. So....it was kinda worth it. Especially considering how far $20k stretched in Mexico.
I'm still rather sad to see the old DandD go under though. Surely adding it onto their new forums wouldn't have been too much expense or hard work.
