Where debating everything under the sun is only the beginning

Consciousness is simpler than hydrogen?

Moreover, God is not complex, much less infinitely complex. Quite to the contrary, God is absolutely simple, and everything else is a complication of it.

God is simpler than hydrogen and therefore a simpler explanation.

Consciousness is Conscious with what you are  doing .
on the other word, you know with what you are doing .

Quote from: Frenzie on 2014-08-02, 07:28:10

Consciousness is simpler than hydrogen?

If you ask in earnest, then first tell me what you believe consciousness to be. Then I will tell you what I believe consciousness to be and I can clarify how it's simpler than hydrogen.

Matter it's never simple, it needs at least electromagnetic forces to hold it together and stable and it subdivides in many components that constitutes it. The lowest atomic number of 1 that characterizes hydrogen doesn't mean it to be a simple thing.

How is it that you (and apparently, only you), know so much about the nature and makeup of god? 

At any rate, you have never mentioned before that god is simpler than hydrogen or even a simpler explanation for this universe, so you must have just decided this on the spot--as with so many other things. 

One can take any seemingly complex object and break it down into its simpler parts and then those parts into even simpler parts until the big picture of the complex object is easily apparent and simple.  Science has done this with the universe, therefore, the scientific explanation is at least as simple...

...but you haven't yet explained, in simple terms, how god came into being or what god consists of--other than being some wispy entity in another realm that is impossible to understand, much less explain.  I don't speak Ersi-ese, so please explain this laughably simple god to me only in simplest of terms, after all, simple things only require a simple explanation.

The universe came into being from a massively dense and hot speck that had no choice but to explode into everything we see now.  If you say god did that, then the god explanation is already vastly more complex.    

Granted, the quantum world is not fully understood yet, but that doesn't mean it never will be simple to understand--we just haven't gone quite that far yet.    

Looks like this is where our real difference lies. For me quantum mechanics is very easy and perfectly intuitive. As it's gradually becoming apparent, you use the word "simple" in the opposite sense, so no wonder that you are not understanding...

Actually, when you say a massively dense and hot speck had no choice but to explode, then you are not explaining anything, whereas conscious willing god qualifies as some kind of explanation. What we are comparing is not a simple explanation versus a complex explanation, but a non-explanation versus an explanation. Simple or complex does not even apply here.

Then a magic pink unicorn, is as equally good and likely an explanation for this universe as any god to have created it? 

(Okay then, substitute the words 'easy to understand'.)

Let's try quantum gravity that you mentioned. What exactly is problematic about it?

When you consider that the basic laws of nature [...]

How would a theory of quantum gravity unify all know interactions in the universe into a single theory of everything (TOE)?      

Edit:  Is string theory a better approach to the problem than loop quantum gravity?  Why/why not?

The question about the simplicity of God (and also the simplicity of consciousness) it's that it is a wrong question. God is simultaneously both simple and complex. (maybe I differ here with ersi)
If you consider simplicity by the primordial perspective, God is the most simple cause of all. If you consider that everything in Creation it's a part of God, then God it's a complexity beyond your comprehension.

Mysteries are pretty 

If you consider simplicity by the primordial perspective, God is the most simple cause of all. If you consider that everything in Creation it's a part of God, then God it's a complexity beyond your comprehension.

That is what is so wonderfully convenient about invoking the supernatural--you can make it do any damn thing you want or need it to do.  You can even make it up as you go along, like you just did and like Ersi does all the time. 

You can wrap your supernatural god up tight with all kinds of protective layers to make it untouchable by any means, but in the end science will win out here on Earth--there is no reason to doubt this whatsoever.

Either learn how our statements make sense in the context of the other things we hold (and ask where you don't see how) or point out where and what anyone made anything up. This way you would yourself make sort of sense.

You are prophecying what's a long-gone past here where I live. And it cannot be that I am half a century or so ahead of time. Rather, I am on time    But nice to revisit history every once in a while.